Serotonin

the four pillars of singing
My Four Pillars of Singing Progress Thread

Rate this topic

25 posts in this topic

Hi

I was overjoyed to finally be able to afford Four Pillars, and I can't wait to jump right in.

I've seen other users create progress threads for their journey through the training programme so I thought I might as well do the same. This is where I'll ask questions/embed sound files of me doing the various exercises in the programme and singing songs so that people can give feedback.

BTW, I was just wondering if I should approach the book like a sponge and just read it cover to cover absorbing everything or if I should dip in and out as and when I need to, using the videos to guide me through my journey then referring to the book when necessary. Which approach would be better or do I need to do a bit of both. I can't wait to get started, but I hope you'll forgive my being slightly intimidated by it. That said, it is a challenge that I am now willing to take on more than I was before.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

read the book and watch the lectures...

Then starts foundation building routine and refer to the book always...i always go to book then ask questions here on forum etc. i read the book around 3-4 time by now + tons of refering to it.

Welcome and good luck bro

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you Elvis.  

I've been working through the lectures, just starting on the whole onset thing. I really want to make sure that I'm not making mistakes so I've recorded myself doing a Q+R onset nut i need some feedback on whether doing the right thing here or not.

 

I think I get a bit breathy towards the end, is that a sign something's wrong?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Seratonin, Hi Guys... just finally getting a chance to sit down after a hellashous week thus far that is none stop... 

 

If you can, read the book completely and watch all the lecture videos. It is important that you:

 

1). Learn the language of vocal technique training.

2). Learn the language of TVS Methodology. 

3). Immediately remove any false ideas or presumptions about singing, training or the voice ... read the "Myth Busting" section of the book early on!

 

However, do NOT wait until you complete the book and the videos to start.. NO!  Get started ASAP... no procrastinating... the first thing you need to do is begin healing your voice or rehabilitating your voice out of the fatigue of bad habits and speech mode. This means... Study "The Foundation Building Routine" first... and focus a lot on the resonant tracking... study the Specialized Onsets and start training them... Study the acoustic mode and begin to learn about the vowels and how to use the properly and how they are different from each other.

Take skype lessons with me if you can... 

http://bit.ly/SKYPEVOICELESSONSWITHROBERTLUNTE

but I hope you'll forgive my being slightly intimidated by it.

Sratonin, please explain?  Why would you be intimidated? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

read the book and watch the lectures...

Then starts foundation building routine and refer to the book always...i always go to book then ask questions here on forum etc. i read the book around 3-4 time by now + tons of refering to it.

Welcome and good luck bro

Ya... what he said...

After reading the book, you then use it as a reference... refer to the training illustrations, the vowel modification formulas, the tables, the training routines in the back, the trouble-shooter table... go to the book to find answers and work the training routines in the back. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you Elvis.  

I've been working through the lectures, just starting on the whole onset thing. I really want to make sure that I'm not making mistakes so I've recorded myself doing a Q+R onset nut i need some feedback on whether doing the right thing here or not.

 

I think I get a bit breathy towards the end, is that a sign something's wrong?

That is not a bad Q&R onset... but I would say it is a bit light... on the quake compression piece, squeeze harder! Stop trying to make it pretty sounding, the Q&R onset is butt ugly... its not pretty.  This is resistance training, so squeeze the glottis...

Make sure you do this on every note of the piano, including the head voice.

When you get to your passaggio, if the Q&R onset starts constricting (as Im sure it will... ), transition to W&R onsets to release the constriction and begin engaging more respiration.. then switch back to Q&R onsets when you get above your passaggio.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That is not a bad Q&R onset... but I would say it is a bit light... on the quake compression piece, squeeze harder! Stop trying to make it pretty sounding, the Q&R onset is butt ugly... its not pretty.  This is resistance training, so squeeze the glottis...

Make sure you do this on every note of the piano, including the head voice.

When you get to your passaggio, if the Q&R onset starts constricting (as Im sure it will... ), transition to W&R onsets to release the constriction and begin engaging more respiration.. then switch back to Q&R onsets when you get above your passaggio.

Okay, I'll keep practicing and try to squeeze as much as possible on Q&R.

As for wind&release onsets, my head voice and passaggio are fairly weak at the moment, so I'm not sure if my W&R onsets are any good, I think I can get the notes okay but the onset still feels weak.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That is not a W&R onset.

That is a long falsetto note. That phonation has little to no sub-glottal attack. It has no energy.

You guys need to appreciate that this takes a LOT of work and a lot of practice. 

Lets hear the belting onsets... get some muscle moving!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That is not a W&R onset.

That is a long falsetto note. That phonation has little to no sub-glottal attack. It has no energy.

You guys need to appreciate that this takes a LOT of work and a lot of practice. 

Lets hear the belting onsets... get some muscle moving!

hmmmm...I thought as much. Like I said, anything in passagio/head voice is currently a long shot so I'll have to just keep practicing. And refer to the book for anything on W&R. 

I feel more confident with my breath control though and my vocal cords already seem to be strengthening slowly but surely. So the programme is already putting me on the right track and I think I'm getting there.

I'll keep using this thread for feedback and advice then :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, it will make you stronger and more coordinated, that is for sure. "4Pillars" is a LOT about... just picking up the weights (metaphorically) and start training... there is a long road to travel for all of us. 4Pillars does a good job of giving you the content and instructions on what you actually need to do... and Im continuing to make that even more and more clear... its a lot about learning how to train and practice.

Master those onsets... not only the coordination and tuning onsets, but the resistance training onsets as well.. D&R, A&R, Q&R and C&R!  ... and train a lot of edging vowels and the neutral "Ah" pingy vowel!

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Alright, so clearly, one of the first and most vital steps to learning to bridge the passagio is to master onsets. I'm not sure if I should try master the technique of each onset within my comfortable range first before moving on to try them in my head voice where I'm more likely to break into a falsetto. For example, I tried W&R again but this time around an A3, it isn't pretty by a long shot, and I don't know if I did it right (I kind of just began very breathy then broke into the note).

PS. Sorry it's a bit quiet, I was far away from the mic because it's not got a great....volume tolerance...the quality is pretty bad anyway though so the "windiness" at the start just kind of sounds like indistinct rumbling. I'll see about getting a new mic at some point so it's easier to listen to and give feedback, but for now I'm stuck with this one.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh and by the way, sorry if I'm uploading stuff sort of sporadically and not in an organised and well-planned out way. I just jumped into Four Pillars and with the enormous amount of content that's vital to practice and get right it's a bit hard not to try and do everything at once. In future I'll try and organise stuff a bit better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think you have to present the exact chronological progression, although that can also be neat. More likely, just day-in-the-life observations. Certainly, the workflow evident in the program will give guidance but you may not be running through everything all at once outside of basic stuff first that leads to the bigger stuff.

I think it would be neat, too, to see the progression of your beliefs about singing, yourself before and after accomplishments with this training. But I do think that is a unique innovation in singing training methodology that is in 4P. It is not just the exercises that can be different and benificial. It is the acknowledgement that there should be pattern to how one starts training and progresses later to different things, like the weightlifter who starts out with easy weights in order to first perfect the form. Hitting the heavy weight from the start allows the body to use wrong and harmful habits. Same to some extent, with singing.

I wonder, too, how the psychology evolves. Sometimes, a person wants to sound like a certain singer. But if a teacher like Robert teaches you how to use your voice awesomely, consistently, reliably, any day of the week, will that change what you need from singing? Does it make you appreciate more music or less? Granted, we are the choir, pun intended and most any of us in this forum listens to several genres of music. I have listened to everything from polka to mariachi. In fact, one of our favorite albums is the Christmas Album from Brave Combo, a local Texas polka band that made it big.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think you have to present the exact chronological progression, although that can also be neat. More likely, just day-in-the-life observations. Certainly, the workflow evident in the program will give guidance but you may not be running through everything all at once outside of basic stuff first that leads to the bigger stuff.

I think it would be neat, too, to see the progression of your beliefs about singing, yourself before and after accomplishments with this training. But I do think that is a unique innovation in singing training methodology that is in 4P. It is not just the exercises that can be different and benificial. It is the acknowledgement that there should be pattern to how one starts training and progresses later to different things, like the weightlifter who starts out with easy weights in order to first perfect the form. Hitting the heavy weight from the start allows the body to use wrong and harmful habits. Same to some extent, with singing.

I wonder, too, how the psychology evolves. Sometimes, a person wants to sound like a certain singer. But if a teacher like Robert teaches you how to use your voice awesomely, consistently, reliably, any day of the week, will that change what you need from singing? Does it make you appreciate more music or less? Granted, we are the choir, pun intended and most any of us in this forum listens to several genres of music. I have listened to everything from polka to mariachi. In fact, one of our favorite albums is the Christmas Album from Brave Combo, a local Texas polka band that made it big.

Yeah I'll probably ease off with the updates later on. It's just that I want to make sure I'm not making mistakes early on. If I get the foundation wrong the rest of the whole process will take far longer. Of course, I don't expect immediate results, but I'd rather avoid unnecessary setbacks. So I'm just sharing as much as I can in the beginning to ensure that I don't learn mistakes and lay the best possible foundation.

 

In terms of psychology, I haven't been using the programme very long but I noticed that I'm much more comfortable with high notes after watching the "Stop hitting high notes" lecture,when you actively think about singing in a deeper position rather than just shouting at high notes, it makes a noticeable difference. The whole myth-busting section of the book is an interesting read as well, gives a much better understanding of how the voice works too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I want to make sure I'm not making mistakes early on. If I get the foundation wrong the rest of the whole process will take far longer. Of course, I don't expect immediate results, but I'd rather avoid unnecessary setbacks. So I'm just sharing as much as I can in the beginning to ensure that I don't learn mistakes and lay the best possible foundation.

 Your head is on straight with this idea for sure... but these journal posts on this forum, are not going to achieve that for you. There "one guy" that can really confirm that for you and he is very busy and not on here as much as he would like to... and in any case, confirming if you are doing The Foundation Building Routine is a task that is way too big for a forum post. 

You need to take skype lessons with me if you want to confirm that you are not making mistakes. Posts in here are not an alternative to that.

 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 Your head is on straight with this idea for sure... but these journal posts on this forum, are not going to achieve that for you. There "one guy" that can really confirm that for you and he is very busy and not on here as much as he would like to... and in any case, confirming if you are doing The Foundation Building Routine is a task that is way too big for a forum post. 

You need to take skype lessons with me if you want to confirm that you are not making mistakes. Posts in here are not an alternative to that.

 

Okay, I won't be able to book lessons for awhile for financial reasons but I hope I will be able to in future. Until then I'll keep progressing on my own, not as effective but the only viable option at the moment. I'll use the demonstrations to gauge whether I'm doing stuff right.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll use the demonstrations to gauge whether I'm doing stuff right.

Great... that is what my video demonstrations are for... and also use the guide files too... same idea, but with a midi synth. voice part...  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Btw dude if it hurts its kinda bad so let also that be your guide. Altough nit every pain is bad. Some stuff that hurt me before doesent anymore because ive done that like 5min few times a day few times. Its mostly belt stuff. Just dont abuse the pain ever.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's now been a few weeks since I got the programme so I have got well into training. So, given that this is a progress thread, here is my "step 1" recording. Something that other people did in their threads so I'll do it too. It's a song that I'm fairly comfortable with as there aren't many high notes. Please Please Please by the Smiths. As I progress I'll probably upload more but this will be the last recording I post for at least a month or so. So yeah..here it is.

 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

THE SMITHS... I LOVE MORRISEY... IM A HUGE FAN!

WHERE IS THE BED TRACK SO WE CAN HEAR IF IT IS IN KEY AND IN RHTYM.

GET A BED TRACK RUNNING AND FIND A WAY TO RECORD YOURSELF SINGING OVER A BED TRACK.

WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT BASIC PITCH AND RHYTHM ARE SOLID... THIS SONG IS NOT A CAPELLA.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

THE SMITHS... I LOVE MORRISEY... IM A HUGE FAN!

WHERE IS THE BED TRACK SO WE CAN HEAR IF IT IS IN KEY AND IN RHTYM.

GET A BED TRACK RUNNING AND FIND A WAY TO RECORD YOURSELF SINGING OVER A BED TRACK.

WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT BASIC PITCH AND RHYTHM ARE SOLID... THIS SONG IS NOT A CAPELLA.

This song is beautiful yes, just wish it could be a bit longer haha.

Anyway, I'll try and get a chord sequence or an instrumental on my phone and sing with it, it won't be great quality but I hope it's enough to judge my tuning.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Go out to the home page and click on the link that says, "Get Bed Tracks HERE!"... look for a karaoke track of the tune. 

Bro, if you don't have the music to sing on top of, it is almost a pointless exercise.

Coach.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay, here's the song with the instrumental. I reckon I'm singing flat - bit blocked up at the moment, but here it is anyway:

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love that Green Day song.

I think you should give a little more attention to Robert's onset work. I think you are onsetting too harsh and it is causing a warble or waiver in your pitch. That is, don't worry about volume, worry about tone, which starts with onset.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now