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Patience (G&R)

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Ronron
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Hi there,

This is my last attempt at Patience by Guns and Roses.

There are a lot of things wrong with this one, but well, still learning and all that. For example, I've been quite surprised at how quick the mic loses track of the voice. I mean, a small 5cm variation and wow, half the sound is gone. I'm still struggling with how I should place myself with regards to the mic and the dB boosts, but it'll come with time. But this is not the worst. The worst is the end. I was about to do another take, but I thought that failure was important to show too. I don't know what exactly I did wrong and (am very interested in not doing it anymore) but there is a wail that sounds even more awful than the others (that are breathy and shaky). So if you happen to know, please tell me :)

The good point is that the verses and choruses are more or less ok, and timing seems to get better every other week.

I'll probably redo this soon, if only for me, with a better ending, because I love this song. Also, I was trying to sing it like I felt it, because I've been tired of chasing the curbing to no avail whatsoever lately. So damnedly elusive :P

Also, before I forget... About that ever elusive twang... Is it there ? And in right amounts ? It'd be so great to be able to stop chasing this one.

G&R :

Butcher's : http://dl.dropbox.com/u/14571174/Patience%20-%20Cover.mp3

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IMO:

Pitch is mostly good. Emotion is good. I think there is some twang but very little. Usually, some twang makes your voice sound more exiting, especially if there are some low overtones in your voice as well. Some chord (or is it cord?) compression or "hold" would probably do you good. That would actally bring out more emotion in your voice, for sure.

On the high notes: The good news is that you have the range to hit those high notes. Even though it was slightly pitchy in one or two places, you hit the notes. Good job. The reason why it didn't sound as authentic and agressive as Axl Rose's version was because of ... the same reason, really, that anyone wonders why they just can't get the right feeling some song - because you weren't using the right vocal mode (or in some cases, people are trying to use the right vocal mode but do it incorrectly). In your case, you needed more twang and even more so than for the low notes.

Which instructionals/instructors do you have?

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Hi Ronron,

Here's my two cents. Worth. You can sing this song, and with a few lessons with a voice teacher, you would have it no worries I reckon. I hear a little work needs doing on support (I noticed pitch wobbles at the end of phrase / breath). I also think a bit of placement work would benefit you with chasing that elusive twang. I agree with jonpall, you definetely have the range there, but better placement / more twang will make a brighter pointier sound, make everything more effortless. I really liked the timber of your voice, particularly in the beginning of the song. It doesn't sound like the original, but personally, I prefer not to approach my pieces like a karaoke attempt - I'd prefer to do it my own way and I will avoid listening to the original artist while I work on a piece. My voice, your voice, everyone's voice is unique and there is no point beating yourself up because you don't sound like the original. Sound like you - you sound good. Work towards consistency in your own sound, rather than chasing Axl's sound.

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So there was some slight twang, BIG victory. I had trouble maintaining it in the lower notes though, and for the higher, well, I'll try. I'm always afraid of adding it though, because of both its impact on tone and volume. I'm always held back by some irrational fear of disturbing my neighbours, who probably aren't home and don't seem to care anyway. Plus, isn't it supposed to brighten the tone even more ? I'll try it anyway.

I do have the CVT book, in French, so I'm not 100% sure on the vowels. That's about it, apart from the forum and youtube that is. I do plan on booking a few lessons when I have both time and money, unfortunately, both are pretty rare right now. As far as the hold goes, I can't quite figure it out right now. I either constrict, lose all sense of support, end with a rasp or shout to go through it. I can get a sound a bit similar sometimes, but it's playing hide and seek with me. And who knows if it's not just Neutral 404 : Sad Neutral ? hehe. The other modes I *think* I can emulate them. Not 100% sure because they're not as loud as I thought they would be.

But I'm reading it again and again. On some day I'll have a breakthrough, some other it'll vanish, but that keeps me entertained and with some faith :P

About the range, it's been a long time since I last checked it, but it's not a big concern (in itself I mean I can go higher, not by a lot much, but still), I just know I have what I need, at least in Neutral. just need to work on it so it is usable all the time, not just when my voice feels like doing me the favor. Yesterday it did not, especially when it was me and the mic, with a backing track. I'm a better sing-along-er if that makes sense. I tend to be afraid of overpowering the music when I'm alone.

I'll record something next week when I have time (as it's very unlikely I'll have some in the meantime).

Edit : haha, I'm always so slow to post !

SH : Thank you for your kind comment. As I said I will try to add some twang and maybe I'll be pleased with it. But I'm fairly certain I'll need some adjustments too : I tend to have a fairly high larynx. I also agree with what you say on lessons. It would do me a whole lot of good. I think I would figure out a few things in a short time. They'll come.

Support is still a bit of a new thing to me, sometimes it goes smooth, sometimes I forget about it and it goes great, sometimes I forget about it and evrything becomes as awful as when I was pushing air :)

I'm also glad it didn't sound like Axl. I wasn't trying to sound like him.

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It's a good rendition. Kind of a choir sound to it, really.

And you've certainly got the range and I ain't worried about a few wobbly notes. I wonder if you might try experimenting with it. Try it with a nasal sound. Embrace the nasal. I wonder what that would sound like, from you, just for interesting variations. Anyway, I also agree with the judgement of others and don't have any pointers to add.

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Unfortunately, twang has once again slipped out of my reach (it's annoying, I can't seem to trigger it at will while singing), and I still can't do any curbing, at least in this song. BUT I've been able to, at least, have an ok shot at a more nasal sound. I think. I can be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/14571174/Nose%20Patience%20covering.mp3

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Excellent effort. I wanted to help you on the high chorus or bridge near the end. You have great pitch. I was just thinking that you might like placing it in the back of your throat to get a brighter tone. I made a sample of what I was thinking of. That is, I think you are looking for a brighter tone. I could be wrong, also.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8750209/Patience%20-%20placement.mp3

You have come a long way in a short amount of time. GnR music is a challenge to sing because even on the balladic parts, it still requires resonance and breath support, both of which you. Placing the back of the throat will probably help aim to behind the soft palate. And a slightly closer adduction will give you some brightness, as well.

I've noticed, to your benefit, you are stepping up to the mic, literally. Bringing it closer so we can here you, which is always good.

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