JonJon

sirenssirens okay, I have these really junky ones that I did on the actual day I learned to bridge lol. or, the day I became conscious of singing up on the palates as I call it. Singing in headvoice, letting go of the tight throat resonance etc its actually fun to look back on these...they are not quite 6 months old and to me now they sound totally horrendous! My range and control has gotten so much better In any case here is what a novice siren might sound like. You gradually leave the chest resonance and embrace the head resonance or vice versa up https://clyp.it/ceg054c2 down https://clyp.it/zkqvnmqi

I got $3 say the chest note aint got good breath to start with

again, I have no idea if the soft palate rises or not. I dont know if my eyes dilate or if my hair looks good lol. I yawned when I woke up but that was a little while back like SexyBeast said, are you getting a good strong vibration etc in your chest notes. Are you getting a decent breath before u try to sing a note? An untrained singer, if he gets a good breath and he sings a decent note, he will generally choke at some point if he just tries to carry that up higher and higher. if you arent choking, then I wonder if you are ever actually getting a decent breath in to start with? Almost sounds like you are using a falsetto chest voice your answer might be to get a good strong chest note going, push it up until you choke, THEN learn to let go of the chest voice and gradually bridge up thru the passagio

2nd video really explains it well. You have chest voice and you have head voice. (yes, im comfortable using old outdated terms lol) there is that range where the voices overlap. At first, an untrained singer has a big gap and he has to flip to yodel to get up to the higher notes. With trainingtraining, the singer is able to smoothly work through that whole range without any huge or sudden changes in tone etc Later on, the singer can learn to work thru that range in different ways. He can sing notes in that range using different techniques. for example lets take the note A4. The trained singer may have 3 different approaches to that note: 1) gradually let go of the chest voice and let head voice smoothly take over. You get a blend of chest and head voice. IMO that would be whats called "mixed voice", though I never personally use that term. I usually just call that "singing in the bridge" or "the bridge area" 2) belting. use more compression etc and forcefully sing the note using more of a chest voice feel. Also called "pulling chest' lol. This is the opposite of what the guys in your vids are doing. Do they sound like Bruce Springsteen or Bono or John Fogerty? no 3) bridging early. This means the singer went ahead and let go of the chest voice feel and embraced the head voice at a lower note than he might normally do. This is what I think of when I hear the term "light mass" singing. Its a stylistic thing to. Some people NEVER belt because they arent trying to get that type of sound. IMO the guys in your vids arent belting, they are using either early bridging or just natural bridging but in any case they are keeping it pretty light. Some people NEVER use head voice because they never learned how, or because they want a loud, chesty, shouty type of sound. other people use various voices as I described. a good singer might use all 3 of those bridging methods in the same song or almost in the same phrase

Sounds to me just what ive said 3 or 4 times now. You need to learn to leave the throat resonance and learn to vibrate the sound off of the hard and/or soft palates (the roof of your mouth, not down in the throat) for me it was a 2 step thing. I could not "bridge" because I didnt have the feel of resonating on the palate. When I tried to sing higher notes I was just trying to take my chest voice (throat voice) up higher and higher and eventually you just choke doing that. Finally I just figured out that I had to find some other way to make sound lol. So I learned how to get the sound up above the choking point in my throat and up onto the palates. Once I got the feeling of singing those higher notes I then started trying to "bridge" smoothly from chest up to head etc (or from "throat" up to "palates" or however you want to look at it) Essentially once you learn to get the sound out of the throat and into the palates etc, its then a matter of thousands of repetitions of sirens and other singing exercises with various vowels etc to make that transitions effortless and smooth. IMO thats ALL those guys you posted are doing. I didnt hear anything inherently difficult there unless i am missing something. They have simply learned to sing lightly thru the passagio etc if you are singing really heavy, or husky, on the low end, it makes it harder to get thru the passagio up to those higher notes etc.

if I had all that in my head when I tried to sing, id be confused to lol

Well its not chest voice is it? Whats left? lol To me its just basic headvoice. They have bridged thru the passagio into the headvoice. They are singing with a light voice, its not really heavy Im confused, if you can sing to c5 then you can sing what they are doing easily

yeah, seems the forum is eating my posts whenever it involves auto formatting or links etc

Sorry, the forum ate my post lol. Basically those guys you posted are just singing in basic head voice. you need to learn to get the sound out of your throat and up more into the hard and/or soft palate. IMO they are not belting or even supporting THAT much. That just basically a light head voice sound.

omg, I posted out a nice long explanation and so far its not showing. The forum has been acting a bit weird lately with eating long posts. Caching issue? It was autosaving it but when I posted it, only half is showing so far wow

you are being very technical when you start to name all of these "techniques" and all of those physiological terms. Keep in mind that thousands of people can sing great who have never even heard those terms. Little kids can listen and mimic singers and noises in nature without knowing the position of their tongue or what their soft palate or larynx is doing. I use those terms and things when I am experimenting to find new sounds, or, when I find a new sound I will then go back and think about the physiology and techniques so that I can then categorize and repeat the new sound. That being said, I can sing a lot of different tones and decent range etc and I pretty much NEVER get into the position of this or that inside my mouth. So far it hasn't been necessary to do so. You can group sounds into broader categories. You generally don't need a microscope. In broad terms, the singing is either "heavy" or "light". A "heavy" sound would generally be way more supported and have a lot more compression like a heavy rock sound or heavy metal. When you think of

a little outta tune around 2:10....other than that pretty cool

yeah, much better, the drums and bass are more audible. I did have to redo ONE out of tune vocal too lol (im sure I left plenty of out of tune stuff but thats just for flavor lol)

nothing like 14 hours of mixing to make u feel like a man..or something EDIT: Rebalanced mix, much better On the Inside, rebalanced mix#1

good learning curve. I have figured out a major mistake ive been making on all my mixes...including those ive posted here, Since i always start with drums, I tend to have them WAAAAAYYY to hot. Then I add guitars and im probably already up around -5db or so. So I dont have much headroom to play with and as I add tracks it just gets to be a mess and ive had to resort to all kinds of freaky workarounds to get the levels even vaguely right So I took my mix that I posted above, which sucks, and I pulled everything down to nothing and I started with drums at a nice low level and I added bass and then guitar. Wow, its like magic lol. No running out of headroom, no having to do weird doubling sends on extra tracks etc etc. Its great...im like halfway to being an idiot savante

never ever said anything COULDNT be done. I fully plan to make mindblowing music. I just like to reiterate and complain out loud how every single itty bitty step has to be some extreme uphill battle. The Beatles were 4 guys plus a great producer plus studio musicians and none of them ever worked a day in their lives. Im 1 guy doing this on top of a full time job. You know the spiel Matthew 21:28-32 28 “What do you think? There was a man who had two sons. He went to the first and said, ‘Son, go and work today in the vineyard.’ 29 “‘I will not,’ he answered, but later he changed his mind and went. 30 “Then the father went to the other son and said the same thing. He answered, ‘I will, sir,’ but he did not go. 31 “Which of the two did what his father wanted?” “The first,” they answered. ----- Im like the first son. I moan and complain but in the end im getting the work done

except for the whole George Martin thing....

actually im pretty sure I could do TV/soundtrack type work lol "finish the production". When I hear that I hear, "bench press 400lbs". Quite an uphill struggle. Laptop really maxed out on that song and I had to "freeze" pretty much all of the tracks as I went...so its a bit of a chore to keep working on it. needs to be totally remixed from the ground up. Dunno. Besides, I have seen the future. lol. Folksy harmonized stuff is the truth

yeah. Thanks for the kind words. Have heard enough times already how this mix sucks, this sucks, that sucks. Spent about a week on this song now, ready for a break. Im no closer to finishing it than before I started it. Good luck finding a "reference track" for something like this. I doubt ill be tackling anymore 80 track songs any time soon The whole musical trip is really weird. I started posting my guitar/drum jams on Fbook. People would say "it sounds weird without words". So I take it upon myself to start singing. Now I feel I have my voice responding well. Of course, as you may know, its never enough. Now I have to have a pro mix too. Im assuming that when I get my mixes together someone will want a video so they can really "feel it" here ya go, a fun little stripped down mix On the Inside, LSD mix A couple more from my massive collection of world famous songs. if nothing else I always could write a good, trippy bridge The Garden Another Fool

Been working hard on getting my mixes better. This one took about a week. Good learning experience. Not perfect but im somewhat proud of it Approximately 80 tracks involved Its going to be a fairly low quality upload because its an MP3 to start with and then uploaded to an MP3 site On The Inside, scratch full mix #1 EDIT: Rebalanced mix, much better On the Inside, rebalanced mix#1 Enjoy, JJ

just in the first 30 seconds of this there are 4 or 5 different ways to say "I" "eye" am the teacher you were lost but "ah" (or "uh") found you "hive learned a few things" (not "eye've" learned)...as "ive" travelled thru the years (not "eye've"" Thuh magician is mii name We'll leave "naim" and "nai-um" for another discussion lol. English is a hodgepodge

Well, in the USA, the word "I" can be pronounced at least 2 different ways. Probably more. Im in the "south" so we hardly ever use a diphthong "eye" for the word "I". So if I say "I am tired", both the "I" and the "tired" are only 1 syllable....they DONT have the gliding diphthong sound "eYE". So "I" and "eye" dont have to be homophones in the south if we say "i'm"...it's 'im' not "eyem" Its a type of laziness where we dont go to the trouble to fully pronounce a word. So we just say "I" with the mouth wide open as opposed to the diphthong which requires more movement etc In the same way, a person from up in the mountains would say a word like "our" as "ire" with the mouth wide open haha, its hard to explain in text. if we say "mine" it wont sound anything like "mayan"...whereas if we say "mayan calender" it may come out more like "mine calender" lol So a lot of times that applies to rock and roll where the singers dont want to sound "correct" or "intellectual" lol. Seriously. If I hear really good annunciation I think of Bruce Dickinson or maybe Geoff Tate style metal...an almost operatic style. (style?? is it "stile" or "sti-uhll" lol) Rock pretty much CAME from the south and from southern blues so a lot of that blues/black/country slang and lazy pronunciation stuck. At least as I hear it, on the DP bridge its "I" know "I" must remain etc....not "eye know eye must remain" pretty clear example here. 'I wanna rock and roll'....not "eye wanna". also check "while" and "style"...no diphthong or this one. about a hundred "I"s..but not a single "eye" HAHA!! Actually Felipe....I got to thinking about "Holy Diver". Is it "diver" or "deye-ver" and sure enough Dio says something like "deye-vuh" and I checked your cover and you did it just like Dio. But then on "oh dont you see what I mean" Dio just says "I" (or actually it sounds like what ah mean").....and when you sing that line you do it like Dio lol. You do "what I mean" and not "what eye mean" So you ALREADY use both (non homophone) "I" and "eye" lol if you go thru many rock songs id say the "I" is used 10 times for every 1 "eye" Beatles rocking the 'correct' "eye love her" Good one here. Not only does Sammy say "I" cant drive 55....he actually pronounces the word 'look me in the EYE" as "look me in the I" lol! Same thing for many words in rock. "mii mii mii" not "meye meye meye" and again, im not saying there is any right or wrong in rock n roll lol. I just pointed that out in the DP song because I have heard that song 9 million times and the 'eye' stood out a bit to me Peace, JJ

I saw it on fbook. All I could think was "someone will surely step on that guitar!"

lol

100% coincidence that I mentioned laryngopharynx....then again I do have native american blood on both sides so it could be a case of unintended clairvoyance, or even a low level diffused spurion from the akashic records. Dunno.