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Discussion on Types of Raspy Effects

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Gsoul82
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I notice that this is something that a lot of people seem to be interested in, so I decided it might be cool to have a discussion.

As some people know, and I have found out, over the last year, just calling something a "raspy effect" isn't that descriptive. There are different kinds of effects that are generated in different ways.

In this topic, let's talk about, and post videos of, the execution of these techniques.

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I have found that grit and rasp are something people try to find before they learn technique because they think it goes against technique. Then when They actually learn technique they find that grit comes very naturally. 

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I have found that grit and rasp are something people try to find before they learn technique because they think it goes against technique. Then when They actually learn technique they find that grit comes very naturally. 

Interesting.Any example of this "grit" or "rasp" that you speak of, or are you talking about all kinds of rasp, in general?

I don't believe that's something that comes naturally for anybody. I believe something has to be done to create it, and it gets easier over time.

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Distortion = turbulence in the sound wave produced. Can be at the fold level or after folds. Fold level mainly unsafe. After folds Healthier.

   Fold level: Too much air pressure to fold closure or Too Little air pressure to fold closure, CVT: Singing between Modes.

  After the folds: False Folds "allowed" to flutter against the air flow, Over Twanging, Soft Palate alowed to "Flutter" against air flow, Uvula allowed to "Flutter" against air flow, Extra mosture in the back of throat

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Interesting.Any example of this "grit" or "rasp" that you speak of, or are you talking about all kinds of rasp, in general?

I don't believe that's something that comes naturally for anybody. I believe something has to be done to create it, and it gets easier over time.

  Yea you are right,  it is not very natural. Here is my point I was trying to make. People want to sing with rasp so they go on youtube looking at videos of how to sing like nirvana and such. They do this before they learn any technique and just end up yelling, pushing and damaging their voices (this happened to me). They are then forced to actually learn singing technique.  Once they learn singing technique they find the rasp is very easy to develop and train. People try to learn to sing with rasp before they learn technique.  They want to be like the rock stars who don't worry about technique and just sing because for some reason they think technique=opera singer. Distortion is kind of like singing in a head/mixed voice. It has to be developed but it feels relaxed and natural when you finally understand it.

I sing with distortion by first singing a clean relaxed note and then slightly twanging with some aggression.  If nothing comes its usually because I'm  squeezing to much. I then back off and try to relax into the sound. 

 

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And when you relax the sound, how does that produce distortion?

Rasp and/or distortion are sounds or anharmonic partials that are not in phase or pitch with the fundamental. It can happen in a resonator or it can happen at the source of vibration. 

For example, Steven Tyler has  genetic anomaly where a secondary aperture toward the front of his folds vibrates. it is anharmonic, not in harmony with the fundamental. It is technically noise but the sound emerges together.

So, if the actual complaint is about young'ns getting raspy singing advice from youtube, what are they doing that is pushing or damaging the vocal folds?

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And when you relax the sound, how does that produce distortion?

Rasp and/or distortion are sounds or anharmonic partials that are not in phase or pitch with the fundamental. It can happen in a resonator or it can happen at the source of vibration. 

For example, Steven Tyler has  genetic anomaly where a secondary aperture toward the front of his folds vibrates. it is anharmonic, not in harmony with the fundamental. It is technically noise but the sound emerges together.

So, if the actual complaint is about young'ns getting raspy singing advice from youtube, what are they doing that is pushing or damaging the vocal folds?

Relaxation does not produce distortion.Rasp and distortion happens a lot easier when you are relaxed and more often than not is the reason no distortion is coming out.  Its something you almost float into by constricting just a hair . People damage their voices because when they follow advice from free youtube videos they end  up yelling, pushing, screaming without any warm up or warm down and they do it all in the throat without any proper support.  Its the same thing that happens when the average person goes to an amusement park or a football game. The popular way to learn distortion on youtube is either 1-buy my program or 2-Push real hard like your going to the bathroom, yell, then drink a lot of energy drinks . to many people go to the 2nd option...

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4 hours ago, YouCanSingAnything said:

I've heard it's the false folds... but how exactly you go about isolating them or how exactly you go about utilizing them I'm unsure..

I've also heard it's an over-engaged twanger can create distortion.

Also very unsure about how exactly "support" is supposed to make distortion easier?... what's going on that causes that?

There's this video I've never watched because it's boring as shoot. I guess I'll watch it now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2zAdvW1wgk

 Most people have made distortions several times without even realising it. Have you ever gotten mad or frustrated about something and let out a little grunt or growl?: HhhUuuuuhhhhn .............. OOOOO that makes me so Mad .......... False fold. How about a grunt when lifting a heavy object?  also false fold......... This is also how people teach support ......... So that is where the support is helpful.

 How about playing airplanes? If you made that airplane diving sound you were Over Twanging.

 Ever cleared your nose by blowing strongly through it and hearing an airy sound? Your soft palate was fluttering.

   Imitated a growling dog?

   There you go.

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43 minutes ago, MDEW said:

 Most people have made distortions several times without even realising it. Have you ever gotten mad or frustrated about something and let out a little grunt or growl?: HhhUuuuuhhhhn .............. OOOOO that makes me so Mad .......... False fold. How about a grunt when lifting a heavy object?  also false fold......... This is also how people teach support ......... So that is where the support is helpful.

 How about playing airplanes? If you made that airplane diving sound you were Over Twanging.

 Ever cleared your nose by blowing strongly through it and hearing an airy sound? Your soft palate was fluttering.

   Imitated a growling dog?

   There you go.

Support just helps take away strain from the throat wich can help free up a healthy distortion. It also helps to aim the sound above the vocal chords. I am no scientist or expert, this is just what I have found with my voice and others. I have found distortion to kinda happen in the face. When experimenting with these sounds you want to make sure you are not to throaty and choky, don't squeeze the throat so hard. I have heard many different ways of creating distortion but they all seem to have one thing in common. They all seem to say that its lighter than you think. My favorite sound effect to do is the buzzer sound like in a game show. It seems to be the best way for me to get the right  sound.

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I'm still working on distortion. It's definitely best to able to sing the notes clean and relaxed first I think. And then add it. Vocal fry / extreme cord closure is what I'm experimenting with. I think it's vocal fry anyway! I'm no expert. When I first did this, I couldn't do it for long at all. It tired my voice out. One time I ended up getting a cold and an awful throat from it! I presume this is because my vocal folds were not used to this. Many people in life will use it naturally when shouting and things like that so it probably won't effect them. But me.. I've never been that kind of person to shout and scream so I never really used it!

Like MDEW said above about people doing it naturally. I look at it from doing what's natural. For example someone who is very angry shouting and screaming. Their voices become distorted. Look at babies screaming away. Their voices get distorted. Many young children do this too without thinking about it. Some children sound like those Death Metal bands that scream! Check out this video below of a boy that seems to be a very big Sonic the Hedgehog fan. He's angry that people don't respect Sonic as much as other video game characters. This video is kind of funny. Love the intro haha! But just listen to those screams! It's way too much but I think the raspy sound comes from the same place.

For the hazy, raspy effect. Try and start it at a lower volume. For me it feels alot easier to create the raspy effect on more heady tones. That's where it's coming from in the video.. the boy's heady voice. 

 

 

 

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Saw this the other day. Dan will probably like this one. I think this guy is using the "growl" effect.

 

 

 

12 hours ago, Robert Lunte said:

Geoff, be sure to refer to the two vocal distortion lessons, tutorials, videos in your copy of "The Four Pillars of Singing'. You can find them in the "Vocal Effects" module.  All new demonstrations... !

 

Will do, coach.

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I have two options:

A. Get a teacher like Dan that knows how to tour with it. Hopefully you can to.

B. Experiment with different coordinations until you find one that does not overly fatigue you with the goal of your voice feeling and behaving the same afterward as it did before.

I don't tour with my distortion so I don't know how it would hold up. It is functional for my purposes. I've sang that way for a couple of hours before and never noticed any detriment. Strangely enough my clean voice often seems to get stronger when going back to cleaner singing.

The first time my voice ever distorted, it was more effortful and fatiguing. I think over time you can isolate more of what is needed vs what is not needed. For me the sensation is twangy, less hootie, almost like a slight leak of air above my folds and bit rattly. It feels intense and there are different vibrations occurring.

That said, I wouldn't chase my sensation because your sensation may be different or you may find a better way of doing it. I can make hundreds of cartoon style voices, and the same principle applies. If something feels wrong, hurts, or sends you hoarse, that one sucks. Revert. Do something 'different' next time. For me the most important thing is: voice same before, voice same after. Always return to the stable voice if you ever try something new.

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