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Struggling with breath

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forgivendays
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I'm using the CVT method. I breathe, the navel (bellybutton area) goes slightly in and the area above it expands as well as my side ribs. I try to keep my ribs and area between expanded and slightly tighten my abs. Still I struggle with almost every line I sing. I run out of breath on relatively short lines and my pitch, tone, and vibrato aren't steady and consistent because of this. This is really holding me back I'm not sure what to change about what I'm doing.

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Damn, you can't sing a line without running out of breath?

You tried the shh exercise? Holding the breath and slowly expelling it through pursed lips? Simply holding the breath?

I do run out of breath sometimes, but never in a single line.

Put up an audio version of you singing and running out of breath.

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Well I don't always run out of breath. I just run out of air quickly and struggle through the finishing the lines. It's very uncomfortable so of course the singing suffers.

Here's AH:

http://www.box.net/shared/z6xtadsgnnoakz1tz4jh

Couple of lines from 2 songs:

http://www.box.net/shared/zt5bz8z5vcp196ckoe0i (The second one is the best take from recording all night long. And you can hear how much I gasp for breath between words. I usually sing this worse only because of breath.)

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I'm no exptert. but part of correct breathing is breathing in enough air to complete the phrase - and only that much air. You want to be empty at the end or close to it because if you are not, you will be storing carbon dioxide in your lungs. Then, of course, you will feel like you are running out of air. Try taking a few deep breaths all the way in / then all the way out - slowly while making a "hissssssss" noise. Then try and sing... Thats how I learned to breath / phrase - may be proper or not lol. Worked for me!

~Keith

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I listened to your recordings. It sounds like your not initiating the tone right off. It's not the amount of breath you take it's how the cords initiate the tone try doing staccato ahs or ehs on a five tone scale not to high ah ah ah ah ah and back down. Make sure no h's in front of the vowel

Dan

Www.danielformicavocalstudio.com

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Great advice Dan and very impressive chops!!! Your background is very similar to mine(except I took way too long to start this technique stuff and your high rock chops are something I'm only recently getting close too after years of work and several teachers.) If you get a chance, any way you could respond a bit on the "High Rasp" thread that Jonpall started? No worries if it's a problem, but you sing the balls off Cornell and Whitesnake stuff that is exactly the kind of sound a lot of people on here are into.

Morid, if you can, go to the CVT Sound Library and click on 3 Overall Principles and then scroll down to Attacks and listen to (46.) practice attack in Overdrive. It's on the 'EH' vowel. Try working on full metal attacks and then re-post. You sound far too breathy in your clips(to my ear) and so of course you're running out of breath. And don't forget necessary twang and support and watch out for constriction and jump up and down while tickling your belly while picking your nose while touching your toes and if you can manage it, moonwalk. This will surely get you there :)

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Thanks for the feedback

The thing is the music I do is mainly influenced by ambient, post-rock, and indie styles. So lots of airy singing and lots of falsetto. I don't think I have a problem with full metallic head voice for example. What do you suggest I do for that?

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Thanks for the feedback

The thing is the music I do is mainly influenced by ambient, post-rock, and indie styles. So lots of airy singing and lots of falsetto. I don't think I have a problem with full metallic head voice for example. What do you suggest I do for that?

just want to point out that consistently airy singing can dry out your folds creating friction and potential damage.

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But if I drink plenty of water I'll be fine right?

no, not really.

water hydrates the folds only from within. excessively airy singing is analygous to chapped lips...you are blowing air against the open folds and basically drying them out topically.

when they vibrate without lubrication it's like your rubbing two dry folds together making them susceptable to wear...if this continues the folds will adapt by producing a defense mechanism, a callous or blister, not a good thing!

when you sing properly with proper fold clousure, the air isn't rushing up with such velocity. the natural mucosa layer helps keep the folds pliable and moist.

this was a basic explanation. bottom line: don't do it very much.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks a lot I wanna stay safe. I'll try to keep it at a reasonable level.

The thing is, airy tone or not I am always struggling for air. It's not like I'm singing airy-er than I should, I usually mimic the stylistic tonal qualities the singer's doing. So if the singer is a little airy, I do the same BUT I still can't sing the same line without struggling. My question is if that's a "lung capacity" thing and if there's a way to increase it?

.

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Thanks a lot I wanna stay safe. I'll try to keep it at a reasonable level.

The thing is, airy tone or not I am always struggling for air. It's not like I'm singing airy-er than I should, I usually mimic the stylistic tonal qualities the singer's doing. So if the singer is a little airy, I do the same BUT I still can't sing the same line without struggling. My question is if that's a "lung capacity" thing and if there's a way to increase it?

.

what exactly to you mean when you say "struggling for air."

struggling because you run out of air too fast?

b.t.w., i've learned thanks to being able to view live performance videos from places like you tube, that a singer may sound airy, but in actuality really isn't. he may have just the right amount of light fold closure (and support) that the run or lick is sustainable. if he's really airy, he's going to run his air past opened folds and expire his air very quickly.

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Yes, struggling because I run out of air too fast. Even if I finish the line, it doesn't sound good because I'm not doing it comfortably or freely.

For me it's really not about being airy. Even if I'm doing very twangy sharp stuff I still don't sustain very well. I'm wondering how I can change that. Do I start doing cardio? More breathing exercises like slowly exhaling/hissing air out or holding my breath for a long time? Or is it all about fold closure?

When I do change my tone to sustain notes longer (which I assume has something to do with fold closure) I don't sound as good as when I'm really putting tone as my top priority. Get what I mean? It seems like my tone will suffer if I want to sustain notes longer and believe me I still don't sustain for long.

Sorry for whining too much. :)

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Listen at 2:35, he takes a very brief breath for a split second and sings a pretty long line that I wouldn't dream of singing. Not that I can't sing the notes and do the phrasing but I can't sustain it for anywhere near that long. So I guess it's mainly fold closure?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UomunyBzR2E

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Listen at 2:35, he takes a very brief breath for a split second and sings a pretty long line that I wouldn't dream of singing. Not that I can't sing the notes and do the phrasing but I can't sustain it for anywhere near that long. So I guess it's mainly fold closure?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UomunyBzR2E

fold closure is a part of it, but it's learning to fill (inhale) "efficiently" with air from the bottom up, and then learn how to meter the air you expel in a very controlled fashion.

buckley, i would say grabbed a very quick, efficient, catch breath through the mouth (quicker and quieter than through the nose) right before he went on to sing that vocal cruise (nice stuff, thanks for sharing that) but he had the control, development, and skill to meter his exhale with his lower expiration muscles of the back and stomach.

some singers can inhale so quick between phrases or even between words so fast that you can't even pick up on it.

it sounds like working on your breath control and support might be a good idea.

listen to lara (all i want is one night with her alone) fabian. the sensitivity of the mic picked up the inhales and if you listen closely, you'll hear the swiftness of the some of her inhales.

she drives me crazy on this song!!

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