Is it possible Im not meant to be a singer?

[neugie92]

Im a songwriter whose found moderate success at age 19 in the publishing world. After years of vocal lessons, reading every book from jamie vendera to brett manning to roger love, I still cant seem to hit high notes with ease and have a voice that really resonates.

is it possible that some people just dont have physiology of what it takes to be a great singer?

[Jens]

How old are you now?

For me it took around 4 years before i saw any progress on My highs. I started when i was 17 went to a ton of vocalcoaches cause i really wanted to sing rocktenor.

With highnotes you really gotta go for it and not hold back, and dare to sound really really bad at first.

[KillerKu]

Ok... Basic question. What would you say is the primary problem with your singing? (Pitch, range, tone, control, etc)

Second. Are you sure you found the right teacher? I know you were saying your last one was having you do tongue stretches. It was either that or the gug exercise I got from Roger Love's book if it was anything I did that caused my voice problem. You're treading some of the same paths I did, and my honest opinion, they aren't ideal paths as rather than winding up with a great singing voice, I wound up with nothing.

So based on what I know, you need to look carefully at what the problem is, and we need to find you a teacher that can address these problems. Lunte is here on the forum, I'm pretty sure he's good. I really like CVT for demystifying aspects of the voice in common language I can understand.

If you can address the problem more specifically, what you believe it is, I or others here might have some additional ideas, or we might not. The main point I'm addressing, is if you find yourself banging your head into a brick wall and going nowhere, you're not going to eventually break through by continuing this. You gotta change course, ok?

[neugie92]

im 19 now. and had to rele

the basic problem i think for most singers is being able to sing higher notes with ease. i just cant seem to relax my throat on them and therefore it causes a lot of tension. tongue pulling excersises whethere there good or bad do indeed help. I had a visit with Katie Agresta (shes worked with everyone from beyonce to bon jovi 125$ a half hour tho totally not worth it) and she also recocmended doing tongue pulling excersises.

pitch is somewhat of a problem also but i think thats more due to using poor technique and therefore coming flat on the note.

Should i buy luntes four pillars? i dont mind spending the money if its actually going to help, but i dont want to get duked into buying another one of these books that hasnt seemed to help me.

you can check out my material http://www.facebook.com/iammatbrandon no pressure tho

[VideoHere]

in addition to jen's advice, yes you can learn to sing...period.

it also has to do with your mindset.

you have to get to a place in your mind where high notes aren't perceived as any harder than low notes.

do you have a sample of your singing (i don't do facebook). sounds like you need a little confidence in yourself.

[Steven Fraser]

im 19 now.

the basic problem i think for most singers is being able to sing higher notes with ease. i just cant seem to relax my throat on them and therefore it causes a lot of tension. tongue pulling excersises whethere there good or bad do indeed help. I had a visit with Katie Agresta (shes worked with everyone from beyonce to bon jovi 125$ a half hour tho totally not worth it) and she also recocmended doing tongue pulling excersises.

pitch is somewhat of a problem also but i think thats more due to using poor technique and therefore coming flat on the note.

<snip>

hi, neugie92! First, some affirmation: Almost everybody can learn to sing higher notes with ease. However, don't worry about 'most singers'. Focus your attention on your particular situation.

Your statement about inability to relax the throat being the cause of tension is a dead end. Don't bother with trying to relax the throat to sing, rather, learn to sing in a manner that allows the throat to relax. Reason? The cause for the tense throat is in the technique, the approach you are using to the singing. You will be tense until you replace the technique.

Please, do not pull your tongue. That will just tell you that your tongue gets tense when you onset, and you already know that is happening. Move forward with learning technique that releases tension at onset, rather than generating tension.

THe starting points for releasing throat (and tongue) tension is the balanced onset, and the removal of unneeded exhalation force from the singing. If you are interested to learn how to do those, write back, and we will point you in the right direction.

I hope this helps. Keep the faith. This is a situation that can be very much improved if you are willing to apply your attention to it.

[neugie92]

I am very interested and thank you for all your help and support.

Here is a behind the scenes look at the making of my EP if any of you guys are interested in what I do.

Basically where im at now is I havent "practiced" vocalizing for over a month. Ive kind of lost what little range the practice i was doing got me.

my routine was some roger love excersises, jamie vendera breathing excersises and some other song work that my vocal teacher gave me.

I think this is good as it gives me a chance to start over and start doing the right thing.

If you guys could help me and point me in the right direction id be very grateful as my vocal seems to be holding back my career.

thank you again

matt

[ronws]

Let me ask the unasked question. Why do you have to sing higher notes? What's wrong with the range that you have? Tom Petty will never hit a C5 and doesn't care to. Some of the most successful singers and songwriters were baritones.

By the way, you don't have to sing high to be a songwriter. Especially if you are licensing your stuff to others to sing. Bob Dylan wrote "Along the Watchtower." Another baritone, Jimi Hendrix, made a huge, monstrous hit out of it.

Don't get me wrong, learn what you can, expand what you can expand. But, like Steven said, what exactly is it that you are trying to do. You don't have to have the largest range. I don't have much of a range. But I don't let that stop me. Rockonwhichyabadself.

[neugie92]

Let me ask the unasked question. Why do you have to sing higher notes? What's wrong with the range that you have? Tom Petty will never hit a C5 and doesn't care to. Some of the most successful singers and songwriters were baritones.

By the way, you don't have to sing high to be a songwriter. Especially if you are licensing your stuff to others to sing. Bob Dylan wrote "Along the Watchtower." Another baritone, Jimi Hendrix, made a huge, monstrous hit out of it.

Don't get me wrong, learn what you can, expand what you can expand. But, like Steven said, what exactly is it that you are trying to do. You don't have to have the largest range. I don't have much of a range. But I don't let that stop me. Rockonwhichyabadself.

again thank you for your response. maybe my phrasing was off. Im not really looking to expand my range and sing notes i cant hit now. im more interested in being able to hit the notes that take strain and force now with ease and comfort so on stage it feels effortless.

sorry for any confusion

[KillerKu]

again thank you for your response. maybe my phrasing was off. Im not really looking to expand my range and sing notes i cant hit now. im more interested in being able to hit the notes that take strain and force now with ease and comfort so on stage it feels effortless.

sorry for any confusion

That's an extremely good goal, for which you'd need the right teacher and material.

You'll need someone or something that emphasizes breath support, breath management, vocal cord closure without strain, potentially vowel modification and someone experienced in deconstriction techniques. I've been doing a yawn sigh voice therapy technique every day, as an example of a deconstriction technique for people who have hyper functional voices.

My honest opinion is Speech Level Singing and it's various incarnations is the absolute worst for this of anything I've read. It's geared for bridging and gaining range through repetitive exercises which can easily be done with strain, with little emphasis on comfort or health. They encourage ignorant beginners to do repetitive exercises (gug, creaky door, etc) that can potentially lead to injury if done excessively or incorrectly.

Steven Fraser on this forum is very well educated, Robert Lunte is learning from him daily. I'd definitely steer towards whatever will reduce the strain, and gain comfortable control over voice.

You have the right idea, by the way, I think your voice sounds pretty good tonally for it's genre, but if you could lift it out from the oodles of autotune that would help so much and I'm really proud of you for taking the steps to improve and work towards this goal, when you might be able to succeed just with the autotune alone.

Try to find someone, anyone, that really knows what they are doing. SLS actually works somewhat for some people especially with the right teacher, but especially when taken by yourself, it's risky. If there is already strain, run, don't walk away. Whatever notes you can get without strain, will be your notes. That's your 'range.'

That's why I can hit quite a few notes myself, but I have no usable range. Not a single note. It's a big difference.

[Felipe Carvalho]

A good coach and get down to trainning. You will do it, I assure you.

[neugie92]

Please look into Ken tamplin I took one lesson with him one and he had me singing skid row. 18 and life I couldn't even hit Ricky was a young boy until tamplins lesson. His teaching worked for me lunte's did not just different types of teachers one worked for me one didn't.

wow thats cool i dont think i could hit 18 and life either. did u buy his book or did u take private lessons wiht him.

[neugie92]

if anyone else has any book reccomendations or something that htey feel really worked let me know. ive tried jamie vendera, roger love, and brett manning.

[neugie92]

if anybody else can make some reccomendations about things they felt useful thatd be great.

[VideoHere]

again thank you for your response. maybe my phrasing was off.

sorry for any confusion

[VideoHere]

again thank you for your response. maybe my phrasing was off.

sorry for any confusion

if you are really serious, you need a teacher. after that, you have to practise. the more you practise (correctly) over time the notes that were a strain for you will become more and more easier.

it's a lot like weight training (in methodology). when you first started out you did dumbell curls with say as an example 15lbs. as you got stronger, you added more weight.

same with the voice...you start out with scales (for example) going as high and low as possible without straining. each day you strive to do more, you stay patient but dilligent..and i promise you the gains will come.

you have to walk before you can run. (i'm trying to help you!)

[neugie92]

the problem is there are no vocal teachers in my area. theres one that i go to but she cant seem to help me and it just seems like a waste of money. if any can point me inthe direction of a book and hopefully i can get a skype lesson with that person.

[Robert Lunte]

if anybody else can make some reccomendations about things they felt useful thatd be great.

Hello?! Thanks guys?

Neugie, I am one of the top voice coaches on the planet. I have dedicated my life since I was 15 years old, to unraveling the mysteries of how to sing through the vocal break and make high notes sound huge and "boomy". My students consistently, (those that take lessons with me, not those that just buy the book and do nothing with it), get results. They get amazing result and they get it quickly.

My vocal training system has sold in over 90 countries around the world, it is titled, "The Four Pillars of Singing" 2.0. "Pillars" has many "firsts" in the industry.

- It offers over 42 original vocal workouts designed to help you build strength and coordination for the hard stuff, bridging your passaggio/break and singing him your head voice.

- It offers the author/producer demonstrating all of the vocal workouts in front of four high definition video cameras, live on stage so you can see, hear and feel how the workouts go... and I believe, be entertained and inspired... as I am one of the few voice coaches on the planet that actually steps up and demonstrates and can eat his own dog food for your educational benefit.

- It offers a new concept to learning the goal workouts that are called, "guides". The guides are audio content of the vocal workouts that enable you to sing-a-long with me and a simulated voice (two separate sets) so you can learn the cues and how the vocal workouts go... this saves time and saves you from having to wait to see me to learn how the vocal workouts go. No other vocal training program has ever offered this feature before.

- All the vocal workouts have also been transcribed into notation for added value.

- The system comes in a digital download (over 16GB of data) or hard copy (5 dvds, 4 cps and a 250 page book).

Here is a video in regards to "The Four Pillars of Singing" 2.0:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlBlsTvHAwQ

I recommend that you also invest in several internet lessons with me over Skype if you are truly going to get serious. You have to train and even when you have the most amazing vocal product, scales and content on the planet... you still need a good teacher in the beginning.

I can help you... Tamplin and CVT were also recommended for you, and i believe they are good systems as well. But you need to advantage of understanding really what TVS and "The Four Pillars of Singing" 2.0 is really all about... I suppose I am bit biased, but there is no product like "Pillars" in the business today and I will guarantee you results, quickly... if, you can hear pitch, and have some gift for singing... and you make an investment in a good product and some lessons... you are on the path to vocal freedom and great potential.

I hope this helps...

[bigfoot]

Yupp - What Robert said..

It'll be the best investment you'll make in your voice. Just buying programs doesnt usually help people because there isnt anyone to clarify doubts and see if mistakes are being made.

Skype lessons with Rob are great, and he really gets the voice, and explains things in a simple, easy to understand manner. Lessons with the coach will make a world of difference.

[Robert Lunte]

Hi, I guess if I were to just give you a simple answer, I would want you to know that in my experience, I have learned that just about everyone can learn to sing. Singing is an athletic endeavor... its a complicated process and skill to master, but it has a lot to do with just building strength and coordination of the muscles in and around your vocal tract and larynx. Like any sport and art form, it takes practice. But even the most modest naturally gifted individual can learn to sing and frankly, can learn to sing very well.

I takes the right techniques, the right teacher, a very obsessive commitment to practicing and really learning how to do it and a passion for really wanting those super human phonations. Do not doubt yourself. It is very rare that someone cannot learn to sing well. Seriously, you can do it, you just need someone to show you how and point you in the right direction for practicing content, techniques, etc...

[bigfoot]

An add on (not expensive!) is to read Anthony Frisell's books (The Baritone Voice, The Tenor Voice, The Soprano Voice) based on your voice type.. It'll really help you understand how and why your voice does what it does.. And suddenly things start making sense.. However, it won't give you audio clips and pre-made exercises (very few).. It costs about $10 as a kindle download, and goes well to complement the Pillars program, because both of them advise singers to sing in a 'top-down' phonation, instead of trying to reach up in chest voice.. The head voice is where it's at mate!

best of luck.

[Robert Lunte]

The Frisell books sound interesting, I would like to read them.

[VideoHere]

The Frisell books sound interesting, I would like to read them.

rob, you owe it to yourself. great, great, book. but the only thing is with the kindle version, the illustrations get blacked out. (frisell was so pissed about this.)

i have had 4 lessons with frisell and he worked my ass off. he had me going from the head voice slides to some serious mixed vocals.

it was an exercise where i had to go from "oo" to "oh" to "aw" to "ah" ...it wasn't all chest and it wasn't all head....it was a balance of the 2, but it's not easy to explain. it was one loud exercise.

i can't get down to him unless i had someone to fill in for me in the store. so it will be a while before i see him again.

he's working on a new book.

head voice slides are a staple in my exercise routine.....but after a few months you have to grow them by strenghtening them to the point where the chest is invited up to join the head. you'll feel and sense the chest "asking" to join up if you do them a lot. a lot....lol!!!

[Robert Lunte]

It all sounds good Bob... I "get it" , more or less what Frisell is doing.

[Mr Bounce]

I find this thread to be quite frivolous because CLEARLY you can sing, as evidenced by the number of quite professionally produced tracks which you have provided us with.. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and presume that this isn't a marketing trick

You already get a great commercial tone for this type of music. The frat boy tenor chest voice has sold a lot of records! Now it's just about finding a vocal instructor who can help you do it consistently so you can do it in performance with no problem.

Btw I quite like your tunes. Do you produce the tracks yourself?