Timing

[Guest]

I'm just a little curious about something based on some things in a recent thread. I'm not a professional singer nor have I even sung with a band other than once or twice. They were impromptu and not rehearsed.

I'm not experienced in this area but I do know a little about music in general having messed with a couple of instruments and singing for so many years. I never gave much thought to timing in singing though. Not as I did playing harp or guitar. After reading and hearing a few things lately I have to wonder. I've heard drummers complain about singers messing with their timing or being behind or ahead (as in the thread here spoke of) and then the band having to adjust etc.

I can understand when it comes to instruments as timing is important. I can also understand timing in vocals, and I try to be in time when I sing. However I don't see why the drummer (or anyone else) would make any adjustments for the singer. The singer needs to be mindful of the timing. I would think the band only needs to play the song. I would prefer the band just play. Let me worry about where and when to fit in. If we rehearse then I will work it out. If it's a case of not rehearsing, then still, just play. Don't change anything. Let the singer fit the vocals to the music. By trying to make adjustments to catch up to the singer I think it throws everything off and it can become a battle.

No?

Tommy

[Guest]

Yea, I would think that the drummer should just keep plugging along. That way the singer can have a marker to get back to. But even if the singer isn't really "off" time. I have heard and read drummers complaining about singers that like to play with the phrasing. Again...so what? Singing is something (to me) that can really be played with and textured. Just as long as you're notes/chords match up right.

[ronws]

Speaking of drums and providing the backbone for the band. This is one of my all time favorite drum performances. Like a rock, indeed. For Elvis sings this a bit rubato and that drum is always there for him to jump back in perfect time, when it suits him.

[Vocalist Dad]

Playing or singing with a solid rithym section is quite a treat. Once that bass and drum lock in with each other, hang on for the ride. Now, there are times when the singer may miss his que when to come in and a really good band can adjust and no one will be the wiser.:cool:

[Matt]

its a good point. I often think many singers are blissfully unaware of the concept of being rhythmically tight. Jazz, soul singers seem to be the ones most aware of this, imo. Incidentally, I was listening to ozzy osbournes vocals the other day, and one of his few saving graces is that he's learned through the years to sing reasonably tight and in time.

Mel Tormé is an example of a very tight jazz singer who stays in time as much as the instrumentalists in the band.

[Steven Fraser]

its a good point. I often think many singers are blissfully unaware of the concept of being rhythmically tight. Jazz, soul singers seem to be the ones most aware of this, imo. Incidentally, I was listening to ozzy osbournes vocals the other day, and one of his few saving graces is that he's learned through the years to sing reasonably tight and in time.

Mel Tormé is an example of a very tight jazz singer who stays in time as much as the instrumentalists in the band.

Matt, et al: In gospel & blues music, the soloist is _supposed_ to synchopate while the rest of the players and singers keep steady time.

[Robert Lunte]

I tend to agree, the drummer following the singer for pushing and pulling time? I guess you could, but its a bit ass backwards isn't it? Seems borderline stupid to me.

Keith Moon? The funny and fascinating thing about Keith Moon is if you ask real drummers, they will tell you he is almost completely tech-less. The guy never had a drum lesson in his life. He plays drums like 'Animal' from the muppets... flails and hits anything with very little context to what he hit before it and what he is going to hit after it. Its controlled chaos and it works, but barely. Keith Moon always just barely hanging on... I won't argue with any real drummers out there that may know better, but this is what I learned from a "The Who" documentary and when you listen to his playing, it seems to concur.

[Adolph Namlik]

Robert Lunte wrote :

Keith Moon? The funny and fascinating thing about Keith Moon is if you ask real drummers, they will tell you he is almost completely tech-less. The guy never had a drum lesson in his life. He plays drums like 'Animal' from the muppets... flails and hits anything with very little context to what he hit before it and what he is going to hit after it. Its controlled chaos and it works, but barely. Keith Moon always just barely hanging on... I won't argue with any real drummers out there that may know better, but this is what I learned from a "The Who" documentary and when you listen to his playing, it seems to concur.

Keith Moon ? My nine year old grandson is a more learned drummer.... :cool:

Now if you want to talk drummers, John Bonham aka "Bonzo" (RIP) in my opinion, is THE best drummer "hands down" EVER !!!

Interesting that John Entwistle, along with Keith Moon had stated that "Lead Zeppelin" would "bomb" !!!

History proves otherwise..... Enough said ?

A bit of reminiscing - Three Rivers Stadium, Pittsburgh, Pa. "Led Zeppelin ~ 24 July 1973" --- The absolute best concert I ever attended !!!

For those who have seen the video "The Song Remains the Same", the Zeppelin concert @ Madison Square Garden - This video looks like a practice session compared to the Pittsburgh concert of the same year.

At $6.25 per ticket, and approximately thirty feet from the stage, it seems like only yesterday.....