Phonation: What to do after the beautifully executed deep breath? LOL

[izzle1989]

What is your thought process when creating the tone? Breathing is the power house of the voice, but what do you all think about to get the vibration going correctly? I feel that before any song can be executed correctly you must work diligently at the fuel(breath) and the tone(vibration) then we can worry about resonance.

Any thoughts about creating the tone/vibration?

[Felipe Carvalho]

Hey Izz! Long time no see.

Emission ajustment is tricky... forward, open, ajusted, not airy, not tight, comfortable and strong, also important that its based on the release of this air, ino connected with support. I think it depends completely on the individual.

Also resonance may be usefull to help the process if not directly trainned. I agree that trainning resonance before making emission solid is not a good idea.

[VideoHere]

izz, hey man, welcome back.

for me buddy, i don't give much thought about it, because i don't want to spoil the spontaneity. i believe there are parts of singing that you have to leave up to the mind to take care of.

you can be too cautious and get tripped up.

do you have a specific example?

[ronws]

Glad to see you back, Iz.

I don't think about the inhale, I let it happen. I control the exhale.

[MDEW]

Phonation: What to do after the beautifully executed deep breath? LOL

Sing?

Welcome back Izzle. :)

[izzle1989]

izz, hey man, welcome back.

for me buddy, i don't give much thought about it, because i don't want to spoil the spontaneity. i believe there are parts of singing that you have to leave up to the mind to take care of.

you can be too cautious and get tripped up.

do you have a specific example?

What I mean is what do you do after the proper inhalation? How do you create the sound? What is your personal thought when creating the sound during exercises?

[izzle1989]

Is there a "wrong" way to inhale?

It can be more or less efficient, but that was not my point. My point is what is the thought process after the inhalation when creating the vibration?

I hope I don't sound rude or anything.

[izzle1989]

Thanks for the greetings you guys. I really appreciate this. I have been really busy with school and Life of course haha! Now I will be back every so often.

[Mivke]

I aim for the feeling of the sound I aim to create, both tone-wise and emotionally and also comfortably. I often forget and sound/feel worse :P

[izzle1989]

Hmmm so far I am seeing a trend with mental imagery of the desired tone. Nice posts guys....Owen I didn't forget about you bro I would like to thank you for your detailed post.

[izzle1989]

Hey Izz! Long time no see.

Emission ajustment is tricky... forward, open, ajusted, not airy, not tight, comfortable and strong, also important that its based on the release of this air, ino connected with support. I think it depends completely on the individual.

Also resonance may be usefull to help the process if not directly trainned. I agree that trainning resonance before making emission solid is not a good idea.

I completely agree Felipe.

This issue is very tricky. The reason why I brought this topic up is because the average student of singing spends a huge amount of time trying to get the proper support. Many times the lower body support may be correct, but the singer does not know what to do after taking that breath.

I believe hearing others point of view will help to clarify and improve the angle of attack for my own technique and other viewers of this topic.

[Felipe Carvalho]

Oh.

I think I understand your point, very true. And I do agree. ;)

[izzle1989]

Thanks bro

[VideoHere]

izzle, you said during exercises, i personally focus on the purpose and benefit of that particular exercise.

there is a perceived ideal way to do an exercise depending on which exercise. so for example, if i'm doing lip bubbles, i know what my goals should be...smoothness, continuity, etc.

the onset will vary depending on the exercise, no?

[ronws]

The right way to inhale is to relax the abdomen and back and let the mouth take an "aw" position and the air will be drawn in by the vacuum.

The real trick is the exhale. Not to much or too little, changing air pressure in a most subtle manner.

Sometimes, just sitting around, not even planning on singing, I make sure I am breathing with my belly. I absolutely have to blame Ron Keel for that. Darn it. And he has sang in more bands than I have. In fact, more than pretty much any of us have sang in.

Sometimes, at night, I may get some sinus drainage and cough a bit to clear it. Then I restart my belly, and then let it go.

Motion in the abs, note in the head, nothing in the throat, ever, amen.

[izzle1989]

izzle, you said during exercises, i personally focus on the purpose and benefit of that particular exercise.

there is a perceived ideal way to do an exercise depending on which exercise. so for example, if i'm doing lip bubbles, i know what my goals should be...smoothness, continuity, etc.

the onset will vary depending on the exercise, no?

Yes I agree with you on this Bob.

Lets just say you were doing a simple 3 to 5 tone scale on a vowel. What would your thought process be for creating the sound?

[izzle1989]

The right way to inhale is to relax the abdomen and back and let the mouth take an "aw" position and the air will be drawn in by the vacuum.

The real trick is the exhale. Not to much or too little, changing air pressure in a most subtle manner.

Sometimes, just sitting around, not even planning on singing, I make sure I am breathing with my belly. I absolutely have to blame Ron Keel for that. Darn it. And he has sang in more bands than I have. In fact, more than pretty much any of us have sang in.

Sometimes, at night, I may get some sinus drainage and cough a bit to clear it. Then I restart my belly, and then let it go.

Motion in the abs, note in the head, nothing in the throat, ever, amen.

I agree with you on this brother Ron. What do you focus on when trying to create the sound? Also how do you not think about the throat when moving through passages that require great agility?

[VideoHere]

gee izz, i really don't think about it....i just vocalize...then i listen back and adjust.

now that i tried to pay attention, (lol) i definitely feel my support engage so as i exercise i feel a "suspended balance." i guess you could call it.

and i automatically configure to a "yawn like" configuration and focus on staying open in the throat (pharynx). i always try to remain "yawn like" when i do scales.

i exercise very loud some days, but monitor to make sure it's derived from resonance.

[ronws]

I know there will always be some tension in order to make a sound. But I honestly do not think of the throat, for any passage. I think of what my belly is doing and where I feel the note, period.

Just one time, I paid attention to the throat. Used raised larynx and constriction to create a mean and ugly sound. And succeeded. To mixed reviews. A few people liked what I did. One person crapped all over it. I don't even normally sing that way and even if I did, just to have "that" sound, I realize that not everyone is going to be a fan.

I will email you a file link, rather than take up space in this thread.

So, I do what I think is right for my voice.

[Gina Ellen Vocalist]

when starting to produce a tone with my students. I demonstrate a breathy and pressed tone then somewhere in between and suggest this as a good phonation to think of. If they have a particularly breathy tone i do some glottal exercises and a pressed tone get then to pull back, follow the resonance instead of shouting it out!

personally i don't think of the tone before i sing, I think of the emotional intent behind the phrase/song

[izzle1989]

@Bob okay I understand where you are coming from. I believe you, Ron, and I have the same point of view about creating the sound. I noticed that I sound and feel better when I just focus on maintaining expansion and not gripping with the throat. When I don't maintain expansion I grip with the throat and when I grip with the throat I lose support.

@Gina I like to use this method too especially when I am not producing the sound I want to make.

[Felipe Carvalho]

Izz Well I figure you know this better than me, but its all part of the deal, if you dont resonate you create more effort, if you create more effort on the larynx you need more pressure, if you need more pressure its harder to support and so on. Ballance. Always ballance, on all the fundaments.

Emission ajustment should be done, defined and then move on, if you keep thinking about how to "start" a sound, how can you possibly worry about mapping resonance for example. Its too much, its one of the things that needs to be studied and made automatic as soon as possible. Not airy, not pressed, not early, not late, ajusted and exactly on time. One of the things that really helps solving the problem once and for all is studying both support and some easy phrases on the metronome making sure that the attack is exact and precisely linked to the release of air. Once this coordination is better, life becomes easier. Metronomes are our friends .

[MDEW]

This a probably the wrong way to do it but if I am having trouble with a note, I will produce the note and adjust if I need to. Then emediately after reproduce the adjusted note. Then continue producing the adjusted note. Not think about it after finding it. Inhale then sing.

[izzle1989]

Izz Well I figure you know this better than me, but its all part of the deal, if you dont resonate you create more effort, if you create more effort on the larynx you need more pressure, if you need more pressure its harder to support and so on. Ballance. Always ballance, on all the fundaments.

Emission ajustment should be done, defined and then move on, if you keep thinking about how to "start" a sound, how can you possibly worry about mapping resonance for example. Its too much, its one of the things that needs to be studied and made automatic as soon as possible. Not airy, not pressed, not early, not late, ajusted and exactly on time. One of the things that really helps solving the problem once and for all is studying both support and some easy phrases on the metronome making sure that the attack is exact and precisely linked to the release of air. Once this coordination is better, life becomes easier. Metronomes are our friends .

Great advice Felipe I totally agree. EVERYTHING is interrelated and if one thing is off the symptoms will show up in the other areas of the voice. As you stated earlier I know these things, but it's always great to discuss this with other people who have made some great progress with these issues.

I am very grateful and humbled to be able to interact with other singers who I can relate to. In my opinion it is very enlightening to listen to the discussions about how to sing because everyone has their own point of view. Since these differing points of view arise it promotes growth in the listener and the speaker. You listen I speak, then I listen and you speak. We all get to learn and we all get to teach. Then we realize that we are not really different at all and many of the things we say are the same, but with different words or a different angle of attack.

I want to thank you all for responding to my posts and thank Robert Lunte for creating such a wonderful forum. To know others you must know thyself and to know thyself you must know others.

Be Blessed :cool: