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Single register vs multiple registers; placement, appoggio

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Here's a good explanation of multiple registers:

Mark Baxter wrote an excellent book (Rock and Roll Singer's Bible) and he is an innovative teacher, with this video

that shows the various types of voices (head, chest, fry, etc.) However, his approach on placements and multiple registers, as can be seen, produces problems-- it's not a "singular" voice and sounds a bit funny.

Tenneli's appogio single-register explanations for effects are far better--one for example

. Tenneli's vocals are clearly "fuller" and sound more like a single person's voice.

Thank you VideoHere for introducing Tenneli to me. Tenneli isn't saying that placement won't ever work, and points out Maria Callas was a rare quality placement singer. He is saying that placement lacks a degree of support and thereby sounds worse.

My opinion is rock singing uses many unusual effects, so placement is often useful (it would take many years of Tenneli appoggio training to reach the range of placement methods), so I think hybrid methods will be useful for rock, pop, and folk, etc. Tenneli also says that by using a mic, placement methods can work for many styles of singing, but it still falls short of one's potential. This makes sense to me as well.

What are your thoughts on all this? Single or multiple registers? Placement or appoggio? Hybrid?

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I don't understand how appogio is different from the usual "support" that everyone teaches, but I'd like to know. I know there's been talk about this already so I guess I'll search the older topics too. Appogio sounds great and everyone talks about it but still I have no clue what it's about. Can one sing without "placements" with the use of appogio? Does this mean no covering, no vowel mods, no nothing is needed when there is appogio?

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Tenelli has innumerable videos on Youtube that covers appoggio.

Support means different things to different vocal instructors, so don't know what support others are teaching. Tenelli is using "support" as meaning abdominal viscera support. I use "support" as entire physical support. Others use "support" as air support, so so it goes on. Tenelli also has a video on asking instructors the meaning of terms, and is also worth watching.

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http://www.videojug.com/film/how-to-sing-and-play-guitar-at-the-same-time

This is an example of "support" and using multiple registers. The singer is an effective emotional singer, but his head voice does sound a bit funny. What Tenneli says is that one can "croon" (do low volume singing), particularly using a mic, and produce good sounds, but according to Tenneli, the singer isn't anywhere reaching near his potential. So, this video is an example of multiple meanings of the word support, the weaknesses of multiple registers, and the necessity of multiple registers until one develops a stronger wider range voice.

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Opaa you are correct you can call support, appoggio or support,if you are doing it correct, call it whatever you like. But tenelli found a good niche (market) to use the word and now everyone thinks it is some secret. There are no secrets or ancient texts.:)

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On one of Tenelli's videos, he explains appoggio style and the word appoggio, which in Italian means support. So Daniel Formica is correct in that appoggio means support. Appoggio style (which I should have used, my mistake) according to Tenelli and others, means single register, dropped larynx, abdominal viscera "pushed" singing style used in opera. Singing terminologies are very confusing and contradictory, which is explained in Tenelli's many videos. It was some American opera star who started distinguishing the terms appoggio style and appoggio word.

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Tenelli uses something he describes as natural placement, which is in itself the placement I know as head voice.

Although using just it through the tessitura will surely eliminate the passagio, since you are already in head voice, a stronger and more agressive posture is often preferred even on classical singing for chest voice, and if you do so, then on the passagio you will have to cover more. I dont see such a static placement even on Tenelli and I never really saw any tenor using JUST head voice to perform, wont work and will sound very weird on the lower notes.

If you dont register into head voice, then you have a problem. Choosing to belt is ok on pop, depending on it every single time, not a good idea. Moreso, if you cant use head voice, chances are that belting will be less than optimal and will produce too much stress to be safe.

To sing pop, using a full placement like that, specially with a lot of covering, will restrict the styles you can apply it, a lot. Not wise and with very, very small returns both in terms of quality and effort/comfort.

And really, from seeing various videos on him, he mainly refer to change of placement when talking about a change in the larynx registration, not resonance. So its pretty much all the same.

As Daniel pointed, apoggio, support, apoio, the name is the least important. What matters is doing it right and using it to sing.

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Natural placement, according to Tennelli, and the semantic itself, is an optimal resonating vocal tone. Just as any instrument has a inherent natural resonance, so does the vocal tract. In "appoggio style", there is only one register, no head voice, no chest voice, no passagio. Expansion of range is achieved by extending from the natural placement.

What Tenneli infers on issues such as belt is that using head register to belt is faster to learn, but sounds better through appoggio style; unfortunately, appoggio takes longer time to learn. The critical change in quality and tone is in the abdominal viscera strengthening under the diaphragm coupled with the drop in larynx. My experiment with appoggio is that it sounds lot fuller than head register placement methods. And resonance in the head area can be retained (the head itself doesn't change) so it's should be fuller, louder, and better sounding. It's fuller because it retains the bassy undertones. It's louder because it utilizes a full push and the larynx opening is maximized. It's better sounding because throat tension is minimized.

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This further brings up the question on passagio. For years, on this forum, I didn't really understand this term, because, as with many people, it was easy for me to change from chest to head voice. I couldn't figure out what forum members were talking about.

So, when Tenneli suggested single register, all I had to do was change my power source from diaphragm to under the diaphragm, and then switch my throat such that the sides of throat opened wider and soft palate relaxed (so as to enhance head resonance--this is different from using a head register--), and within a week, I think I am able to activate a full voice, using what appears to be appoggio methods.

So, my experience is that a single register does work.

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For the most part, I never liked multiple registers. It's not necessarily the sound quality-- different registers create different personae, but more because songs are usually an emotional story, told from a singular person's perspective. So, when switched, it sounded like the storyteller changed, and this confuses the listening audience. Single register, it seems to me, has more emotional impact.

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web,

if you are a new fan of appoggio support natural placement singing (as I am) bear in mind it's just you and me against the forum...lol!!!!

it is a very physical way of singing which requires a physical, deliberate transference of tension away from the vocal tract to the lower core muscles and you sing sustaining and maintaining that tension so as to leave the vocal tract unencumbered by tension and relaxed to the degree that the voice responds naturally.

you have to practice to get it strong to the point where no part of the vocal tract tenses as it likely will when you first start to learn this.

if you apply this support and you feel a tension anywhere in the vocal area, you're doing it wrong.

it produces, as you've said, a very powerful, resonant, rich beautiful tone within a certain range of 2-21/2 octaves.

as tenelli has pointed out this has to modified for non-classical singing because the lower larynx position needed for this type of singing won't produce the super high rock notes where the larynx may need to come up.

but... if you ingrain and imbed yourself with this kind of support, I think it can go a long way in improving versatility.

we are in the minority on the forum though, because not everyone believes that elements from the classical approach can be pulled into singing stuff like bruno mars.

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My opinion is that both Videohere and Owen are correct-- it's all different views of a bigger picture on vocal expression.

I think Owen's 4th point regarding tonal variety is something appoggio doesn't do as well. And Videohere is correct about appoggio's inability to create super high rock. For example, the song "Lion Sleeps at Night". I can't imagine appoggio making the falsetto sound right, but when there's a switch to its line.. "Hush My Darling, don't fear my darling....", the smoothness of appogio can win easily. So, for variety, placement can add spice to life.

As noted earlier, I didn't have trouble with placement's passagio (#1), but couldn't make my voice sound smooth and couldn't sing highs with power, using placement methods. Appoggio made quick improvements here. So, I'm with Videohere--appoggio style can create impressive improvements.

Owen's points #3 #5 I disagree with-- appoggio produces a much smoother and softer sound--controlled by the diaphragm. I'll elaborate more on Owen's #1 #6, #7 later--these are related to posture.

The most influential part of singing, for most audiences, is the emotional impact. Both appoggio and placement are appropriate to express certain types of emotions, and can both be utilized.

However, if had to pick one, I'm in Videohere's camp--Tenneli's appooggio style improvements are much more impressive than what I experienced using all kinds of placement methods.

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Videohere,

One thing I don't understand is why a lowered larynx can't be used to produce super highs, in a hybrid appoggio.

The frequency is produced by the independent vocal cords, there's more power due to appoggio's greater push, more space is created by lowered larynx--for greater amplification. Placement of frequencies to facial mask still can be accomplished. Result should be a greater high. It's not a screaming high--as a scream brings many throat muscles into play. But, with some practice, I think it can be a screaming high. Why not?

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web, yes, you can go very high with appoggio technique, but not rock singing/metal high. honestly, i'm not too sure why, that's a great question, but I believe from what I've read a lowered larynx can limit range on the high side.

appoggio is in actuality a tension reducing technique which is exactly what helps you with high notes.

these videos explain a lot...in sequence.

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Thank you VideoHere. Lots of new ideas in these two videos; won't be able to multitask to review these.

Anyhow, Owen's point on dramatic tonal singing using placement is acknowledged in the case of Maria Callas in the second video.

I'll have to review these again, when I can concentrate--certainly worth watching at least twice.

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Guys things dont have to be appart from each other, they potentialize each other, its complementary not excludent...

The usuall reference to head voice is not because of the brake, but exactly to create the reference of the "natural placement". Which is just relaxed and optimal, but for that you sacrifice vowel definition, you wont have an open spoken quality AH on natural placement, the vowels must ajust, and ajusting vowels is ajusting resonance, thus it is manipulation of placement.

Placement concept connects support, emission and resonance in one thing. Support/appoggio has everything to do with it.

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I'm unsure I understand what you're saying Felipe. The two videos Bob showed above includes something similar to what you're saying. Tenneli says Maria Callas changed from pure appogio to a "passive-diaphragm" appoggio, which can include placement. In still another video, Tenneli described natural resonance as being capable of being chest voice. Tenneli's position is that placement and pure appoggio are different--multiple registers versus single register. But placement and appoggio apparently can be integrated in the videos' "passive-diaphragm" and "crooner" types of appoggio.

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I agree with Bob that Tenneli favors the appoggio technique with no active placements ("pure appoggio"). For our forum though, I'm unsure pure appoggio is best, as Tenneli indicates that pure appoggio's primary advantage is vocal power for opera.

Tenneli does say that dramatic opera singing (Maria Calas) is favored by many listeners, and Tenneli also says that "crooner" and "passive-diaphragm" appogios' tonal quality can still be enhanced by full diaphragm counter-force (as in pure appogio). But my inference is that this full diaphragm counter-force is a marginal increase in quality tone as compared to ascending to higher types of appoggio.

And since I'm too lazy to take years to develop full-volume, operatic pure appoggio, I'm inclined to go with "passive-diaphragm" appoggio.

O, no, no, no, oh opera is what I'll stay :)

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Bob the key is, what is "active" placement?

well, since i made that term up, i guess i should explain myself...lol!!!

by active placement there is a conscious and intentional use of registers. when i engage support with the level tenelli refers to, the voice feels like there are no registers from bottom to top. the support takes care of the passaggio. you wonder where the registers went, really.

please take time out to watch the entire 7 part series, it's been so beneficial to me. maybe because i have a big voice to move? not sure....but this support he advocates is amazing.

that's okay..my buddy dan formica thinks i'm nuts....lol!!!! i guess whatever works for the individual.

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true in many cases, but the one where you disengage and transfer the tension, the more physically demanding version, makes for a richer, higher quality, more powerful sound...i'm able to achieve such tension reduction up above...

..just my opinion folks.

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