To sing rock music register you will probably use the most is mixed vo

[The Scientist]

I was just wondering if what I think here is correct:

TO SING ROCK MUSIC REGISTER YOU WILL PROBABLY USE THE MOST IS MIXED VOICE.

Here are some examples, where I think that singers are using mostly mixed voice:

3 Doors Down - Here without you

Faith No More - Easy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9X_msJ-7OI

Pearl Jam - Jeremy

...and most of their songs are in similar register.

You can hardly get lower/more powerful sounding voice they have if you use head voice too much. And you don't want to push up your chest voice. So I find mixed voice the most useful register in today's rock music.

Am I right? So if I want to sing rock music the register I should concentrate on mostly will be mixed voice?

[ronws]

Sorry to burst your bubble but Michael in Faith No More is using plenty of head voice, as it were. Technically, there is no mixed voice, at least in CVT. Or, as I like to phrase it, it's all head voice since your resonating chamber is approximately the pharynx to up behind the soft palate. It's all a matter of how a note is resonated in a space. The vocal folds are about the size of your thumb, approximately, unless you are Uma Thurmann in the movie "Even Cowgirls get the Blues." And your resonating chamber is about 6 to 7 thunbwidths tall and about as big in diameter, though that is variable.

Which doesn't take away from the need to learn skills that allow you to resonate notes in areas different than where you resonate, say, your speaking voice or even your highest note. But really, that is still dependent on how your air column is shaped, the tension of your folds and how much of those folds are vibrating and how fast.

[keoladonaghy]

TS: You may want to go back a few messages in this forum and check out the "Covering" questions.... " thread that has been going on here for a while. There are some fascinating and informative discussion of the terminology regarding that range you're referring to.

I agree with what I think you're saying. Personally I find to my ear that the juiciest part of male vocals tend to fall in the D4-G4 range (except for some exceptional folks), though more of the song tends to be below that. I was working with Robert Lunte today on a song where the meaty parts are a D4-D#4-E4 chromatic run and a punch on G4. It sits right in my passagio, and is tricky for me, trying to decide to hold on to the belt/twang on the E4 or going into head voice. Six months ago I would have had to use a weak falsetto to hit any of those notes.

Working with Jesse Nemitz at Singing Success last year and Robert this year I've learned to get a more balanced tone which is far less bassy and boomy in the low range, and fuller at the top, using the "top-down" phonation Robert stresses. In my lesson today I asked him for us to focus on the lower and low-middle part of my range, because I felt I hadn't focused enough on it, focusing instead on the passagio the range above it. It went great and I'm glad I did; it took us into experimenting with new techniques that I think will be really beneficial.

Good luck with your studies.

[Robert Lunte]

What do you mean by "Mixed Voice"? :rolleyes:

[kalapoka]

I was just wondering if what I think here is correct:

TO SING ROCK MUSIC REGISTER YOU WILL PROBABLY USE THE MOST IS MIXED VOICE.

Here are some examples, where I think that singers are using mostly mixed voice:

3 Doors Down - Here without you

Faith No More - Easy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9X_msJ-7OI

Pearl Jam - Jeremy

...and most of their songs are in similar register.

You can hardly get lower/more powerful sounding voice they have if you use head voice too much. And you don't want to push up your chest voice. So I find mixed voice the most useful register in today's rock music.

Am I right? So if I want to sing rock music the register I should concentrate on mostly will be mixed voice?

oh boy! are you in the wrong place!

[Matt]

Strange there is so much controversy about the term mixed voice, I think of it more as 'middle voice' though.

[jonpall]

C'mon guys, if some vocal coaches want to call something a "mixed voice" why not let them? Why fight/disagree with them?

I think the term is easy to understand and can be very helpful. It's basically singing with medium volume with the proper vowels around your passagio, or "curbing" (CVT) in the tenor range ("high part of the voice" in CVT terms).

You are correct with your assumption IF you are talking about notes around your passagio, yes. Spending time working on your mixed voice will really help you as a singer, and frankly open up opportunies for you to play more gigs = more job opportunities for you as a vocalist. Since I started to develop a bit of a tenor voice myself, I noticed a big difference in the reaction from the crowd, so yes, it seems that high, powerful notes (in the E4 to E5 range) really strike a chord in the audience - just as long as you don't sing up there constantly.

But for the low parts of the songs you posted, they're not really using the mixed voice. However, there is an Ab4 note at the end of the Faith no more song ... and that IS using the mixed voice - sorry Ron to burst your bubble, or re-burst it. At least that's my opinion. I say so because you can hear the Uh vowel when he sings "easy". He sings it as "easUh" - which is curbing = mixed voice.

[Matt]

You can hardly get lower/more powerful sounding voice they have if you use head voice too much.

Powerful singers like Dio or Tom Jones are examples of powerful headvoices

[analog]

Sorry to burst your bubble but Michael in Faith No More is using plenty of head voice, as it were. Technically, there is no mixed voice, at least in CVT.

CVT calls it Curbing. It is a half-metallic sound...meaning one half metal(Overdrive/Edge)/one half non-metal(Neutral.) About as pure a definition of "mixed voice" as you can find.

To quote the English version of CVT (under chapter on Curbing)

In the beginning it may seem like a balancing act to sing in Curbing, because the Curb may be lost in both directions(Neutral one way or Overdrive/Edge the other.) Therefore, Curbing is regarded by many as the most difficult mode and the last one to fall into place

My personal opinion is that it is "avoided" in some circles because it's so tricky to master. It's NOT black and white. There are so many shades and variations that it can be a bit overwhelming at first.

[Snorth]

I think why many people don't like the term mixed voice is because the whole "mix chest and head voice" explanation is abit wierd. Personally, learning curbing by feeling the crying sensation or the hold has worked alot better for me cause it's more concrete. BUT then again we all work differently, I can't say that will work for all.

[jonpall]

Both Seth Riggs and Brett Manning have said that in order to sing in mixed voice, you have to put a little cry in your voice - the same thing that the CVT book talks about. It's just the SS/SLS DEFINITION of mixed voice that it sounds kind of like a mix between a powerful voice (chest voice) and a light voice (head voice). What's so freaking hard to understand about that? Sorry to be so blunt. I'm not directing my comments to anyone in particular but this is just my opinion on all of this :)

[kalapoka]

I second Jonpall. :D

[Martin H]

jonpall,

Yes but Brett Manning also says that the "mix" is a combination of the mouth and nasal resonance. So now the "mix" is suddenly related to the velum port....in other words you can't sing in "mix" with a raised velum because that would leave out the nasal cavity! What???

You see, they are vey vey vague and often contradicting in their definitions....sorry :(

[jonpall]

Ok, perhaps there are some flaws in the way they describe that stuff, but it seems to help some singers. However, I do see your point. I hadn't thought of that. Cheers, Martin. :)

[VideoHere]

Ok, perhaps there are some flaws in the way they describe that stuff, but it seems to help some singers. However, I do see your point. I hadn't thought of that. Cheers, Martin.

i've got it...how 'bout "passagio" voice?

[analog]

jonpall,

Yes but Brett Manning also says that the "mix" is a combination of the mouth and nasal resonance. So now the "mix" is suddenly related to the velum port....in other words you can't sing in "mix" with a raised velum because that would leave out the nasal cavity! What???

You see, they are vey vey vague and often contradicting in their definitions....sorry

What the hell is that about? Makes NO sense whatsoever. Are you sure they're not trying to explain twang by calling it "nasal resonance"...or do they LITERALLY mean to keep nasal port open and have air exit through mouth and nose(as a condition for the mix?)

[Martin H]

analog,

Yes, that's what they say.

They say that "belting" comes directly out of the mouth(which is not wanted)....and "mix" is a blend of mouth and nasal - "resonance"....And this is from "Mastering Mix" - 249,99$ :rolleyes:

[gno]

I'm not sure what way is the best. It seems that each of these methods present their own ways of describing voice, right or wrong. I personally think CVT has a really nice set of theories and all the research they have done is amazing. I haven't been exposed to all the different methods out there, but I'm totally on board with Catherine. I have to give credity to Brett Manning in that seeing some of his youtube videos got me excited about singning again. His 6 octave video is almost unbelievable, except that he does it right before your eyes. It seems that he is totally connected througout that whole range. Is he flipping in and out of CVT modes when he does that or is he doing it all in Curbing?

[jonpall]

Doing sirens well is of course no proof that you can sing well. But maybe you've heard a clip of him singing as well? Actually, even if he didn't sing all that well, it's how good his students get what matters for him as a teacher.

[Snorth]

I'm not sure what way is the best. It seems that each of these methods present their own ways of describing voice, right or wrong. I personally think CVT has a really nice set of theories and all the research they have done is amazing. I haven't been exposed to all the different methods out there, but I'm totally on board with Catherine. I have to give credity to Brett Manning in that seeing some of his youtube videos got me excited about singning again. His 6 octave video is almost unbelievable, except that he does it right before your eyes. It seems that he is totally connected througout that whole range. Is he flipping in and out of CVT modes when he does that or is he doing it all in Curbing?

Most of is in neutral. Curbing above F5 is VERY unusual. Metal like neutral works perfectly up there.

[Martin H]

Well here are 3 clips of Brett Manning singing - then you can decide for yourself if he can put his own teaching into practice ....(PS: You need a Facebook account) :

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=550897270866&subj=628263270

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1250952084013&subj=628263270

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1250940603726&subj=628263270

[analog]

Just amazing. Brought tears to my eyes.

[Snax]

Well here are 3 clips of Brett Manning singing - then you can decide for yourself if he can put his own teaching into practice ....(PS: You need a Facebook account) :

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=550897270866&subj=628263270

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1250952084013&subj=628263270

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1250940603726&subj=628263270

Keeping it real...all those clips were horrible!!! Is he tone deaf? His Bohemian Rhapsody sounded like he was shouting too. So much for his "light is right approach" to singing. It appears that it just doesn't cut it for singing anything loudly or with conviction. I think his instructional videos are very slick but his actual singing as an artist is beyond bad!

[jonpall]

A few of Brett's students, some of which have become vocal coaches, all of which you can find clips of on youtube, actually outsing Brett. But he says so himself - "most of my students eventually outsing me". So he has never claimed otherwise. It might be the case that he likes to sing in an entirely different style than what he usually teaches, which includes a lot more falsetto and breathyness and overdoing the cry/hold. Don't know. Just guessing.

[VideoHere]

Well here are 3 clips of Brett Manning singing - then you can decide for yourself if he can put his own teaching into practice ....(PS: You need a Facebook account) :

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=550897270866&subj=628263270

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1250952084013&subj=628263270

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1250940603726&subj=628263270

with my business i'm a little afraid of facebook...any other way to hear his singing?