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Jabroni
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I've recently made a concerted effort to lighten the mass of my phonation as I ascend. This has been a HUGE help as I kept getting "stuck" at A#4 and could never get past it to B4 in a light mass configuration.

 

I have no problem "pulling chest" and getting a more belty, beefy head tone B4 and above; in fact, it was much easier for me to access the notes above A#4 by using more M1 musculature. It allowed me to go up to D5 and even to E5 easier than the light mass way; now after trying to "shed the weight" as I ascend, I've been able to get bright, twangy head tones on B4 and couple of times on C5 as well.

 

As Robert has said before, the light mass way is MUCH less tiring on the voice, it almost feels effortless but sounds bright and connected. As of now, I can only sustain and "pull" M1 so high for so long before getting fatigued: not straining, as everything feels open and free, but my voice gets tired much easier than compared to the light mass way. Continuing to train the M1 "pull" should provide more stamina so I can utilize it for longer periods of time.

 

As for the light mass configuration, this is the sound I ultimately want, the James LaBrie/Geoff Tate/Rob Halford way, as opposed to the Bruce Dickinson way. Not that there's anything wrong with Bruce, he's one of my favorites, but it's not the sound color I'm looking for. I'm glad to have found both configurations and will train and utilize both of them.

 

Moral of the story is if you are looking for a light mass sound color, keep your phonation light and lighten the mass as you ascend. Robert has mentioned this before in his online videos but until I tried applying it yesterday and today, I didn't fully realize how big of a difference it makes. I feel as if my voice just "slots" into the proper place when slightly modifying the vowel and lightening the mass. It's a very delicate configuration.

 

Just figured I'd share my story and a bit of advice.

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It's always awesome when we finds new stuff with our voices. I'm happy for you, mate :D

Don't neglect what you did before, though and go crazy lightening stuff, as your voice might have a stubborn moment there, haha. It will like to go to that heavy place now and again.


Whenever you can, please, post a sample so we can hear and compare both approaches!

Cheers, mate!

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From all of the clips by this guy, this one helped me a lot. He speaks about 'light mass' or 'being a wuss' at the end. Once I've started singing more gently in the lower notes I found transition to be easier and higher notes to sound chestier - or at least mixed. I suppose that sounding 'big' isn't just about pushing air. You give a little in the bottom to get something at the top. 

 

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It's always awesome when we finds new stuff with our voices. I'm happy for you, mate :D

Don't neglect what you did before, though and go crazy lightening stuff, as your voice might have a stubborn moment there, haha. It will like to go to that heavy place now and again.

Whenever you can, please, post a sample so we can hear and compare both approaches!

Cheers, mate!

 

Sure! I was practicing today but couldn't get a good sustained B4. I'll try again tomorrow.

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Jabroni,

 

May I just say this is not always true....(Your "Moral of the story" sentence above)...

 

All voices are different, different weights, different timbres, and textures. You will come to find you don't "have" to lighten intentionally as in back off or cut back on anything to shed weight as you ascend.

 

The correct vowel/vowel shade will help along with creating height in the back of the throat. You could be singing loudly yet still induce lightening or better yet, releasing.

 

You could sound powerful as hell, yet still be releasing.

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Good post... I think it is a very strong testament that you need to pursue BOTH, "top-down" technique ideas and "bottom-up" technique ideas. I have been doing this for many years... you need both. You don't have to make a choice, even though I think there are some voice coaches that would happily lead you to believe that that you do. (This is because it rather serves their agenda). But understand both.

 

As of late, "The Four Pillars of Singing" has a good amount "bottom-up", belting techniques and routines in the system. I hope to not sound like Im just pitching my program, but the point Im  wanting to make is... you should train both approaches.

 

The fact that the voice response better sometimes when you lighten the mass is no surprise what so ever. "lift up / pull back" is great for beginners because it trains the body to stop constricting and just get a decent release. Apart from the fact that it will give you a different sound color. In the end, Bob is right... you want to train for balance on your mass, based on the sound color you need.

 

Hope this helps... 

 

BTW ... this coach above near the piano is Justin ? ... forget his last name, but I like this colleague. He speaks well and kinda knows what he is talking about.  Good content. 

 

Here is my lift up / pull back video that was pretty popular...

 

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Great video, Robert! Brilliant idea for training constriction out of transitions.

 

Off topic, there's a certain movie actor/comedian to whom you bear an uncanny resemblance. Surely not news to you, but I couldn't help noticing!

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Great video, Robert! Brilliant idea for training constriction out of transitions.

 

Off topic, there's a certain movie actor/comedian to whom you bear an uncanny resemblance. Surely not news to you, but I couldn't help noticing!

 

Yes, yes... I know who you are talking about... I have heard this for years... I never forget the first time I heard this... It was about 8 years ago, I was actually just completing my Master Class with Tony O'hora in Birmingham, UK... and at the end of my Master Class I asked a class full of college freshman if they had any questions and this kid in the back raised his hand and said, "... did you know you look like Jack Black"... that was the first time I heard that, but I hear it all the time.

 

Honestly, I really don't see the resemblance much... maybe the sarcasm a bit, but this idea really escapes me. But its very prevalent, so it must be real. Thats fine, I think Jack Black is totally cool.

 

I would love to do a skit with him one day... where he is doing this "Inhale Singing" joke.

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Yes, yes... I know who you are talking about... I have heard this for years... I never forget the first time I heard this... It was about 8 years ago, I was actually just completing my Master Class with Tony O'hora in Birmingham, UK... and at the end of my Master Class I asked a class full of college freshman if they had any questions and this kid in the back raised his hand and said, "... did you know you look like Jack Black"... that was the first time I heard that, but I hear it all the time.

 

Honestly, I really don't see the resemblance much... maybe the sarcasm a bit, but this idea really escapes me. But its very prevalent, so it must be real. Thats fine, I think Jack Black is totally cool.

 

I would love to do a skit with him one day... where he is doing this "Inhale Singing" joke.

 

What really makes it uncanny is not just that you look like him to a pretty significant degree, your mannerisms and speech are almost identical to his. You would do some really kickass impressions if you ever tried!

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Yes, yes... I know who you are talking about... I have heard this for years... I never forget the first time I heard this... It was about 8 years ago, I was actually just completing my Master Class with Tony O'hora in Birmingham, UK... and at the end of my Master Class I asked a class full of college freshman if they had any questions and this kid in the back raised his hand and said, "... did you know you look like Jack Black"... that was the first time I heard that, but I hear it all the time.

 

Honestly, I really don't see the resemblance much... maybe the sarcasm a bit, but this idea really escapes me. But its very prevalent, so it must be real. Thats fine, I think Jack Black is totally cool.

 

I would love to do a skit with him one day... where he is doing this "Inhale Singing" joke.

Robert, I can see a slight resemblance to Jack Black, but really not too much.

 

Personally, I can see more of a resemblance in some of your previous videos to Ian Gillian, in his younger years of course. About the time Perfect Strangers was released in 1984.

 

As for myself, when I was younger, I was confused with Al Greenwood, previous keyboardist with Foreigner. I have to agree in a sense... That long, long hair and slender build !!! Yes, a really close match in looks especially when the Double Vision album was released in 1978. At "gigs". people would actually INSIST I was Greenwood. It was like - "Hey, if I were Al Greenwood, would I really be playing these small venues ?"  Enough said....

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Yes, yes... I know who you are talking about... I have heard this for years... I never forget the first time I heard this... It was about 8 years ago, I was actually just completing my Master Class with Tony O'hora in Birmingham, UK... and at the end of my Master Class I asked a class full of college freshman if they had any questions and this kid in the back raised his hand and said, "... did you know you look like Jack Black"... that was the first time I heard that, but I hear it all the time.

 

Honestly, I really don't see the resemblance much... maybe the sarcasm a bit, but this idea really escapes me. But its very prevalent, so it must be real. Thats fine, I think Jack Black is totally cool.

 

I would love to do a skit with him one day... where he is doing this "Inhale Singing" joke.

 

I think most people mean it in a good way. The other day, I was watching your mic demo from the Hard Rock Café. My wife passed by the computer and saw you and said, "is that Jack Black?"

 

Thing is, we are big fans of Jack Black in pretty much everything he does. Acting, singing, writing. I think a lot of it had to do with your hair being in kind of a rock shag look. But you have a more angular face, so the resemblance is not like a clone, more like a general look. Kind of like, I have been compared to Hulk Hogan, though I am taller and Hogan is heavier. I certainly never thought of Hulk Hogan as pretty or handsome but I can live with that.

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LOL... its all cool. I agree, there could be a really funny skit between he and I.. where Im trying to teach him something serious in vocal technique and he insists on his "Inhale Singing" thing... that could be really funny. I've always thought about that... 

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Robert, I can see a slight resemblance to Jack Black, but really not too much.

 

Personally, I can see more of a resemblance in some of your previous videos to Ian Gillian, in his younger years of course. About the time Perfect Strangers was released in 1984.

 

As for myself, when I was younger, I was confused with Al Greenwood, previous keyboardist with Foreigner. I have to agree in a sense... That long, long hair and slender build !!! Yes, a really close match in looks especially when the Double Vision album was released in 1978. At "gigs". people would actually INSIST I was Greenwood. It was like - "Hey, if I were Al Greenwood, would I really be playing these small venues ?"  Enough said....

 

 

Yes, Adolph..I can see it.....LOL!!

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Videohere wrote:

 

"As for myself, when I was younger, I was confused with Al Greenwood, previous keyboardist with Foreigner. I have to agree in a sense... That long, long hair and slender build !!! Yes, a really close match in looks especially when the Double Vision album was released in 1978. At "gigs". people would actually INSIST I was Greenwood. It was like - "Hey, if I were Al Greenwood, would I really be playing these small venues ?"  Enough said...."

 

 

 

Yes, Adolph..I can see it.....LOL!!

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Videohere wrote:

 

"As for myself, when I was younger, I was confused with Al Greenwood, previous keyboardist with Foreigner. I have to agree in a sense... That long, long hair and slender build !!! Yes, a really close match in looks especially when the Double Vision album was released in 1978. At "gigs". people would actually INSIST I was Greenwood. It was like - "Hey, if I were Al Greenwood, would I really be playing these small venues ?"  Enough said...."

 

Videohere and ronws :

 

First, Robert > Yes, I definitely see the resemblance in Robert's "mannerisms" and "facial expressions" per Gillian 1984. COOL !!!

 

And myself > Was playing in a band, "Scarab" at that time and literally had to argue with some people who INSISTED that I was Greenwood. You'd never know it today as I can no longer grow my hair that long ! LOL Old age will do that unfortunately.

Anyway, I had some photos back then and wish I could post them, but unfortunately, my "sweetie" at that time decided SHE needed them more than me.... Oh well !!!

 

 

 

Yes, Adolph..I can see it.....LOL!!

 

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I dont think it is really looks wise really robert reminds people of jack black. I mean yeah there is some resemblance in a way. I think it is more his personality. The way he pronounces some words and his phrasing. Also his body language and vocal tone and timber. When i first saw robert on you tube, i believe mix is dead was the first vid. Jack black def crossed my mind very quickly.

None of this is a bad thing, he makes life more interesting. I mean I would love to have some of his mannerisms whenever I am giving lessons in whatever. That is a gift to have that kind of positive, passionate, and motivational attitude without it seeming faked or forced.

Plus there are much much worse people to be compared to, Jack Black is pretty cool.

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Great clip Robert! I liked the 'Belting is a polite word for shouting' thing. :)

 

As for Jack Black, there's a well known guy (in Youtube world) who does demos for guitar gear and gets a handful of 'are you Jack Black?' comments for every video:

 

Maybe he has a double on every instrument?  :P

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Strange indeed.. I have an archaic but simple theory; bare with me.  At the dawn of the time during the first major evolutionary transitions from cro-magnon to homosapien there spawned a single man imbued with uncanny musical abilities.  Despite the extremely primitive nature of society (if you can call it that) this one man was conjuring up music with rhythm and harmony bearing striking resemblances to the popular western theory of today.  However, the peers of this man deemed him too powerful.  His musical genius bore him with powers of influence that were simply too much for a single man to wield.  After a brief committee a seance was commenced and the shamans of the early tribes separated this being into ten different host.  The only catch?  Though the musical talent had been dispersed evenly, the personality of the original host was copied nuance for nuance and did not change a bit between each new man.  The tribes grew restless as to how to solve the problem as it was not in their interest to have ten of practically the same people in one community.  So, after a brief council was held it was decided to release each of the new hosts into different regions of the Earth.  5000 Years Later:  As predicted the separate men thrived in their communities and their ancestry lived on, spawning copy after copy of the same musical masters.. and personalities.  

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Strange indeed.. I have an archaic but simple theory; bare with me.  At the dawn of the time during the first major evolutionary transitions from cro-magnon to homosapien there spawned a single man imbued with uncanny musical abilities.  Despite the extremely primitive nature of society (if you can call it that) this one man was conjuring up music with rhythm and harmony bearing striking resemblances to the popular western theory of today.  However, the peers of this man deemed him too powerful.  His musical genius bore him with powers of influence that were simply too much for a single man to wield.  After a brief committee a seance was commenced and the shamans of the early tribes separated this being into ten different host.  The only catch?  Though the musical talent had been dispersed evenly, the personality of the original host was copied nuance for nuance and did not change a bit between each new man.  The tribes grew restless as to how to solve the problem as it was not in their interest to have ten of practically the same people in one community.  So, after a brief council was held it was decided to release each of the new hosts into different regions of the Earth.  5000 Years Later:  As predicted the separate men thrived in their communities and their ancestry lived on, spawning copy after copy of the same musical masters.. and personalities.  

 

Oh ya... 

RUSH - "Discovery"

 

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Strange indeed.. I have an archaic but simple theory; bare with me.  At the dawn of the time during the first major evolutionary transitions from cro-magnon to homosapien there spawned a single man imbued with uncanny musical abilities.  Despite the extremely primitive nature of society (if you can call it that) this one man was conjuring up music with rhythm and harmony bearing striking resemblances to the popular western theory of today.  However, the peers of this man deemed him too powerful.  His musical genius bore him with powers of influence that were simply too much for a single man to wield.  After a brief committee a seance was commenced and the shamans of the early tribes separated this being into ten different host.  The only catch?  Though the musical talent had been dispersed evenly, the personality of the original host was copied nuance for nuance and did not change a bit between each new man.  The tribes grew restless as to how to solve the problem as it was not in their interest to have ten of practically the same people in one community.  So, after a brief council was held it was decided to release each of the new hosts into different regions of the Earth.  5000 Years Later:  As predicted the separate men thrived in their communities and their ancestry lived on, spawning copy after copy of the same musical masters.. and personalities.  

 

I was totally at a loss in understanding this and I have been through a few different states of mind and views of reality.

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And Robert, don't worry about the Jack Black thing. To me, it means you are inventive and creative with a similar huge voice and a sense of comfort in your own skin. Me, some have compared me to Hulk Hogan. I am taller and don't weigh as much. But, according to Hulk's own bio, he is actually afraid of confrontation whereas I get in a person's face when the situation calls for it. 

 

When my hair was long, I had been compared in looks to James Hetfield, Ted Nugent, and Fabio. Yeah, the italian model guy. But think I looked like the Minnesota Vikings logo when my hair was long.

 

One time, I put my short pic into a site that compared your features to celebrities. The two that came up were Glen Frey (the Eagles) and Trent Reznor (Nine Inch Nails.) I am probably closer to Glen Frey.

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I was totally at a loss in understanding this and I have been through a few different states of mind and views of reality.

 

LOL... I'm with you there mate.  I'm on the straight and narrow line now though, just running off overactive imagination.  

 

 

And Robert, don't worry about the Jack Black thing. To me, it means you are inventive and creative with a similar huge voice and a sense of comfort in your own skin. Me, some have compared me to Hulk Hogan. I am taller and don't weigh as much. But, according to Hulk's own bio, he is actually afraid of confrontation whereas I get in a person's face when the situation calls for it. 

 

When my hair was long, I had been compared in looks to James Hetfield, Ted Nugent, and Fabio. Yeah, the italian model guy. But think I looked like the Minnesota Vikings logo when my hair was long.

 

One time, I put my short pic into a site that compared your features to celebrities. The two that came up were Glen Frey (the Eagles) and Trent Reznor (Nine Inch Nails.) I am probably closer to Glen Frey.

 

I completely agree, it's a huge compliment in my eyes.  The only similarity I see between Robert and Jack personally though are their mannerisms and passion for music.  

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