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Classical Style to Rock?

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SlashRock05
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Uhm, hey there! It's been a long time since I opened my acc. in this website, for I'm enjoying my current singing career. So, I'm in a choir right now and I sing baritone or high bass/low tenor. My range for now is G2-G4. I can execute a E2 in a volume of a singer's chest voice.
Btw, I've been singing opera lately, (for about 6 months) and I am classified as a baritenor by my instructor. My range in opera was from a brief A2-A#4, 2 octaves and a semitone. Hahaha And I've been wondering if Rock singing could help me extend my voice up to the extent of my cords. I watched videos of connecting the chest to head voice and bringing power towards the passagio. If I could be, somehow, successful in bridging my chest and head in a type of rock way, could I use that in singing classically? Specifically, Bel Canto. That's all my questions now. Hahaha Thanks for the replies in advance. ^_^

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If I could be, somehow, successful in bridging my chest and head in a type of rock way, could I use that in singing classically? Specifically, Bel Canto. That's all my questions now. Hahaha Thanks for the replies in advance. ^_^

Hi,

 

I think it's important that you be aware of the specificity principle derived from exercise physiology. Which means, if you want to sing classical, practice that. If you want to sing rock, practice that.   :)

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 If I could be, somehow, successful in bridging my chest and head in a type of rock way, could I use that in singing classically? Specifically, Bel Canto. 

 

Learning how to get through the passagio or transition from M1 to M2 is somewhat style independent.  If you can do it in one style, correctly, you'll be able to use that coordination in the other style.  However, there are some sound ideals that are different for each style.

 

What Martin says is important - if you're goal is to sing opera you will probably reach your goal quicker by trying to apply the coordination to operatic songs rather than rock songs.  

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Learning how to get through the passagio or transition from M1 to M2 is somewhat style independent.

 

Yes it should be. But speaking for myself I can sing Stevie Wonder, Jamiroquai etc... no big deal... but as soon as I sing classical I have so much trouble around F4.

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Yes it should be. But speaking for myself I can sing Stevie Wonder, Jamiroquai etc... no big deal... but as soon as I sing classical I have so much trouble around F4.

 

I'd like to hear some Jamiroquai. That would be cool.

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Yes it should be. But speaking for myself I can sing Stevie Wonder, Jamiroquai etc... no big deal... but as soon as I sing classical I have so much trouble around F4.

 

That's where the different sound ideals come in to play.  I began by singing rock and later had operatic training.  During my operative training I could never sing a Tenor aria - I worked in a lower range, up to G4.  But a few years ago learned how to expand my range in a big way, from Tamplin's program - he's a rock singer but the coordination is the same.  Now I can sing Tenor arias.  I think it is because I already learned how to handle the passagio from a classical perspective.  It is a different sound ideal and a set of vowel modifications that are a little different from for example Stevie Wonder.  It is Martin's Specificity Principle at work.

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Thanks for the replies people! ^_^ So, doe it really matter if I learn the "rock way" and just apply the coordination I got for classical singing? I know they sound really different, but the only difference I see and hear was the projection and covering of sounds (in opera). I have been into Baroque Opera lately, (Pavarotti's) and have practiced my full voice projection. But there's something that bugs me out and says that I should learn the modern operatic style, (Josh Groban's or Il Divo's?) which is somehow lighter in sound (Bel Canto).

And to add up, I really like rock songs especially Bon Jovi's. As far as I know, Bon jovi's makes use of a raspy but connected tones throughout his body. I read an article discussing about how to connect the passagios and build up a mix to project in a somehow full voice and necessary twangs in head tone. What I'm really into now, is to discover the coordination I needed and does it matter if I learn from a completely different style? Thanks. Haha ^_^

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I do not usually make use of twang related exercises, for I do not merely focus on high head tones. I have this mezzo quality type of voice and sounds like a girl. Hahaha :3 It really sounds like a soprano, but the problem is that everytime I try to go down the notes, there was a big break that insults me out. Haha I think this applies the same to Pavarotti's vocal technique. He sings in full voice, but I think he never did learnt to connect his lower to his upper registers. But he could amazingly sing a High D in full voice. Haha

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I don't know, but I've watched his vocal range video. And at the top of his notes was like D or Eb. There was an E and F at the end that was a head/falsetto sensation that I think was not in his full opera voice. Isn't that his falsetto?

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I don't know, but I've watched his vocal range video. And at the top of his notes was like D or Eb. There was an E and F at the end that was a head/falsetto sensation that I think was not in his full opera voice. Isn't that his falsetto?

 

 

I just watched the Pavarotti Range Video and his top "fully adducted" note was D5.  At Eb5 he switched to a less adducted, falsetto configuration.  Not sure if he never learned how to connect or not.  There are other operatic tenors like Rockwell Blake that are totally connected all the way up.  Opera doesn't require that tenors go super high.  But they are very well trained through the passagio and up to C5.  E4 to C5 is trickiest part of the tenor range - for most singers.  It's that switch from M1 to M2 and staying adducted so that the listener can't tell the difference which takes a lot of practice.  Once you get past that it becomes easier in a way.  I guess modern rock techniques will help you learn to go up to C6 and beyond if you want.  Opera teachers are not going to care about that because there isn't a need but they will help in the tricky part of the range.

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What Geno said. And if you consider that most of a tenor passage in an aria or an opera is really concerned mainly with the region between C3 and C5, unless you are leggiero, then that upper 4th octave is what you have to work on. I suppose it depends on the opera or piece involved and what the director was going for. Even if a trained tenor goes to falsetto above C5, that is not a bad thing, if that tone is called for. It's only in the heavy screamer genre that the idea of falsetto is considered gauche. Just as limiting a sound ideal as anything accused of limiting in opera.

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Oh okay. I get it. Fully adducted. Hahaha Maybe if I have much more free time, I'd be able to do a sample of my full operatic voice for you to judge and mention both posi and nega comments. Hahah Thanks for the replies so far. And maybe a clip of my bridging in rock way.

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http://picosong.com/LcQf Here is a sample of my operatic voice. Any comments are welcome. Both posi and nega. Hahaha In this quality, any tips on how to fully connect my current range to a higher set of notes? My quality is kind of thicker and heavier type, but does it really matter whether it's heavy or not? Thanks for the replies so far. Maybe I'd upload my coordinated range in a more of rock way. Thanks!

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http://picosong.com/LcQf Here is a sample of my operatic voice. Any comments are welcome. Both posi and nega. Hahaha In this quality, any tips on how to fully connect my current range to a higher set of notes? My quality is kind of thicker and heavier type, but does it really matter whether it's heavy or not? Thanks for the replies so far. Maybe I'd upload my coordinated range in a more of rock way. Thanks!

 

I hear tongue tension. Tone is too dark/woofy - it doesn't sound natural.

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It seems to me that you are engaging swallowing muscles to get that "operatic tone", an exellent example of what I mean is when you say "no matter how hopeless". It is noticeable in "no matter...". It sounds ike when people imitate opera singers.  Activating swallowing muscles is not useful for singing unless you are doing a Disney character or something, haha.

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http://picosong.com/LcQf Here is a sample of my operatic voice. Any comments are welcome. Both posi and nega. Hahaha In this quality, any tips on how to fully connect my current range to a higher set of notes? My quality is kind of thicker and heavier type, but does it really matter whether it's heavy or not? Thanks for the replies so far. Maybe I'd upload my coordinated range in a more of rock way. Thanks!

Yeah, I don't prefer so much that tone but I imagine it can be useful. It would be great to here you sing it more open, as did Peter O'Toole. That was one of my favorite movies as a kid. Nothing like seeing the original release.

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That is what it really happens when I sing with a low larynx config. Whenever I imagine to lower the larynx, my tongue goes down and make that woofy sound that is too heavy.. That is the only way I can project over a large area. So how could I remove this swallowing habit? Does it affect how I reach even higher notes? Thanks. ^_^

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Whenever I imagine to lower the larynx, my tongue goes down and make that woofy sound that is too heavy.. That is the only way I can project over a large area.

 

It might give you the illusion of a big sound, when in fact you could project much better with a more natural sound. If you're seeing a teacher he should be correcting this.

 

 

So how could I remove this swallowing habit?

 

Listen to your clip. The way you speak and sing is totally different. I think you're trying too hard to sound classical! Often I will tell people who go into "singing mode" to first speak the phrase and then sing it the same way not trying to change anything.

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Here is my record of full operatic voice  http://picosong.com/L9rM
I think I already removed the tongue tension and made it more free and I'm shocked for it's kind of more resonant and louder. Hahaha The neighbors have heard it and thought it of somebody fighting. Hahaha XD Is this already correct? The last note was shifted to head tone, and not from the tongue modification. It was a more free tension than the feeling of belting in full voice. Do you think I can go higher than that when in this type of sound? Replies please? Thanks. XD ^_^

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Because you don't seem to be able to hear the differences in tone. Maybe it's a recording thing, I don't know... but either way your voice doesn't sound "natural" like theirs.

Their volume and tone is produced by sheer compression and air pressure, all only happening at the vocal folds. And coupled with that, an incredible control over their resonant spaces. This is what gives them that roundness and the "in the very back of their throat" quality in the sound. You are trying to achieve the same sound by probably doing something with your tongue and swallowing muscles. And it can be easily heard because you lose the tone in several parts of the recording.

00:39"to be willing to march into hell.." and it sounds tense. Tense in a way that robs you of resonance and sounds muffled. That's what Beast means by woofy.
and the following "heavenly cause" that OH sounds heavy in swallowing muscles/tongue tension.

What I found weird, is... how are you able to maintain that operatic tone in 1:34, when you are doing a breathy coordination for a couple of words? That's why I'm pretty certain it's because you are aiding the tone with unnecesary tensions for singing.

From 1:09 to 1:15 sounds natural, and I think you should try to sing the whole song with that timbre. You could try that, record it and post it, and see what happens :D

And in the last high note, if you notice, at the third vibrato oscilation ( there are 5 ), your configuration changes, and the "enclosed" quality of the sound emphasizes even more. What did you feel or did there?

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