nyarlathotep Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 Hi My name is Emil and I am 25 I always wanted to sing like Michael Kiske or Geoff Tate. (strong clean high pitched vocals) I always sing along to those artists with passion whenever I can. I have developed quite nice high range and I can reach that high heavy metal squeeks almost always. But when I record myself on camcorder I've realized that I sound weak/wimpy/girly in comparsion to my idols... My vibrato is ugly when recorded... I am sure that some people will surlely LoL at my recordings when they will hear it. So I wont post any covers on YT yet... The point is that I WANT improve my voice in BEST possible way. BTW There is no vocal coach in my area that could help me. So my questions are : What excercises will help me get stronger more "mean" and solid voice ? What excercises will help me archieve nice smooth pleasant vibrato that Mr. Kiske have ? What excercises will help me get that awesome stamina and power that Geoff Tate had when he was younger ? I' am also big Rob Halford and Dio fan but whenever I try to sing something heavy like "The Sentinel" my throat hurt badly and I am struggling with melody... thats (*auto edit*) up... It's really so hard to learn to sing in that style of music properly ?? Maybe there are some special recording tricks used to record heavy metal vocals ? I strongly believe I can learn but how long it will take I dont know... I dont wanna quit it beacouse I am addicted to it already... I just wanna to sound more PRO and stop being ashamed of mine own voice. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshual Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 I you want the Geoff Tate tone buy the 4 pillars by Mr Robert Lunte, in my opinion he's the best coach for that kind of singing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VideoHere Posted September 8, 2010 Share Posted September 8, 2010 Hi My name is Emil and I am 25 I always wanted to sing like Michael Kiske or Geoff Tate. (strong clean high pitched vocals) I always sing along to those artists with passion whenever I can. I have developed quite nice high range and I can reach that high heavy metal squeeks almost always. But when I record myself on camcorder I've realized that I sound weak/wimpy/girly in comparsion to my idols... My vibrato is ugly when recorded... I am sure that some people will surlely LoL at my recordings when they will hear it. So I wont post any covers on YT yet... The point is that I WANT improve my voice in BEST possible way. BTW There is no vocal coach in my area that could help me. So my questions are : What excercises will help me get stronger more "mean" and solid voice ? What excercises will help me archieve nice smooth pleasant vibrato that Mr. Kiske have ? What excercises will help me get that awesome stamina and power that Geoff Tate had when he was younger ? I' am also big Rob Halford and Dio fan but whenever I try to sing something heavy like "The Sentinel" my throat hurt badly and I am struggling with melody... thats (*auto edit*) up... It's really so hard to learn to sing in that style of music properly ?? Maybe there are some special recording tricks used to record heavy metal vocals ? I strongly believe I can learn but how long it will take I dont know... I dont wanna quit it beacouse I am addicted to it already... I just wanna to sound more PRO and stop being ashamed of mine own voice. Thanks how long have you been singing? are you just starting out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyarlathotep Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 Hmm. I was singing to metal for fun since I was 15. I was trying to emulate J.Hetfield and Trent Reznor. When I was 18 I went into 'real' metal singing like James Labrie and Bruce Dicknson mainly, then Kiske and Tate. I am not trained musician so probaby I have learnt bad vocal habits and I am still using poor technique. I was thinking that I could turn my "hob by" into something bigger over time. joshual<== thanx for reply but 4 pillars are too expensive for me...(159$) and not avaliable in my country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akarawd Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Hi My name is Emil and I am 25 I always wanted to sing like Michael Kiske or Geoff Tate. (strong clean high pitched vocals) I always sing along to those artists with passion whenever I can. I have developed quite nice high range and I can reach that high heavy metal squeeks almost always. But when I record myself on camcorder I've realized that I sound weak/wimpy/girly in comparsion to my idols... My vibrato is ugly when recorded... I am sure that some people will surlely LoL at my recordings when they will hear it. So I wont post any covers on YT yet... The point is that I WANT improve my voice in BEST possible way. BTW There is no vocal coach in my area that could help me. So my questions are : What excercises will help me get stronger more "mean" and solid voice ? What excercises will help me archieve nice smooth pleasant vibrato that Mr. Kiske have ? What excercises will help me get that awesome stamina and power that Geoff Tate had when he was younger ? I' am also big Rob Halford and Dio fan but whenever I try to sing something heavy like "The Sentinel" my throat hurt badly and I am struggling with melody... thats (*auto edit*) up... It's really so hard to learn to sing in that style of music properly ?? Maybe there are some special recording tricks used to record heavy metal vocals ? I strongly believe I can learn but how long it will take I dont know... I dont wanna quit it beacouse I am addicted to it already... I just wanna to sound more PRO and stop being ashamed of mine own voice. Thanks Hi Emil, My name's Thanos and I'm now 34. I started "singing" metal at the age of 18 trying to emulate the big cats. I didn't have a single note, I didn't know how to approach singing and even doing a 2 note scale seemed unearthly. I was always researching, I acquired a huge bibliography on the subject and always tried to do the exercises in these books. I soon realized I was missing sth - that was breath support so I went back and "learned" that. Did I really ? How could I tell ? Questions were flying inside my head and any teachers I went to told me I didn't need the range and that my larynx should keep down etc - they didn't know any better and this sort of forum was unheard of. But I had to follow their advice and I kept my larynx down - I was hitting geoff's high notes with my larynx down - I was straining. So the years passed and my work which involves talking for 96h a week made things worse. I did lose my voice around 2 years back due to acid reflux and with it a 5000$ deal and a chance to be recorded by a top producer in the US. Nowadays, after 15-16 years I've found the strength to admit I've got to go back to the basics and build a strong foundation. This forum and the modern vocal methods out there allow no excuses for NOT doing that. All the big cats are either natural born singers or have worked their butts off to make it happen. Why am I saying all this ? 'Cause if I knew then what I know now, I would have spent a long time solidifying my techniques first and not get to the mess I am now. Can I sing now ? Listen to my examples in the review & critique section. Some are just ok and some are really sloppy. And all that 'cause I wanted to go from 0 to 100 without spending time on 2,3,4 etc So I am back to basics and re-learning everything to un-do the evils I brought on to me. Are there any exercises I hear you say. I suggest you spend a good amount of time researching in this forum and you'll get great answers. Start by taking care of your body for singing and breath support and then move on to the rest. If there's any vocal trait you hear in any members or vocal techniques, I'm sure they'll be happy to analyze what they do. I'd be very happy if one would avoid the pitfalls I didn't by reading this. All the best, Thanos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snax Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 If you heard your idols singing while recorded on a camcorder, you might be shocked that they don't sound anything like they do in a recording studio! High notes sound pretty thin when there is no reverb or delays to thicken them. What you need is exactly what Robert Lunte and others here offer...complete vocal courses created to get you the results you are seeking. You can't expect to get there for free really. Is it worth the money to get your voice to that level? Only you know the answer to that my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyarlathotep Posted September 9, 2010 Author Share Posted September 9, 2010 I think I can tighten my belt so I can afford 4PoS if that will help me somehow. Looks like that It's worth to try !! (many positive reviews). Is there any electronic version of it and how much it weight ?. I've heard/read that SLS is not going to help me beacouse singing heavy metal is more advanced and extreme and aproach must be done in diffrent way. Snax <== thanx for advice ! I want to ask From the recording point of view. I have Rode NT1-A condenser , Tonsil MD-248(yeah preety oldschool) dynamic and Firewire solo. You have mentioned reverb and delays. What other plugins are used to make vocals sound "mean" or more proffesional. Is my equipement any good ?(sure neumann U87 will be better in any way, but I am low on budget, u know). Its little bit OT but I just wanna know For now I assume that 4 pillars is my priority to get better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snax Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Your equipment is just fine but a lot of the thickening and spacial effects are done after the recording process is over with during post production. I sincerely think that Robert will be able to help get you to a much higher level than you could do on your own or by just trying bits and pieces of what we have posted here on the forums. Don't be shy about posting clips of yourself here by the way. We have all heard enough poor quality recordings to realize that good technique and high end recordings are two different things. No one is going to laugh at you and it makes it so much easier to offer suggestions when we can hear and especially see what you are doing now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 <snip> I've heard/read that SLS is not going to help me beacouse singing heavy metal is more advanced and extreme and aproach must be done in diffrent way. <snip> Hi nyarlathotep, I am a voice student too and have tried Singing Succuess (a version of SLS) and I agree that it might not be the best thing for singing metal. I have not tried the Four Pillars of Singing, but I do plan to get a copy, and agree it sounds very interesting. Out of all the things I have done so far though, the complete voice institute's book has been the best value for the money. I would love to hear how you like the Four Pillars of Singing when you get it though, it is next on my list to check out. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VideoHere Posted September 9, 2010 Share Posted September 9, 2010 Hi My name is Emil and I am 25 I always wanted to sing like Michael Kiske or Geoff Tate. (strong clean high pitched vocals) I always sing along to those artists with passion whenever I can. I have developed quite nice high range and I can reach that high heavy metal squeeks almost always. But when I record myself on camcorder I've realized that I sound weak/wimpy/girly in comparsion to my idols... My vibrato is ugly when recorded... I am sure that some people will surlely LoL at my recordings when they will hear it. So I wont post any covers on YT yet... The point is that I WANT improve my voice in BEST possible way. BTW There is no vocal coach in my area that could help me. So my questions are : What excercises will help me get stronger more "mean" and solid voice ? What excercises will help me archieve nice smooth pleasant vibrato that Mr. Kiske have ? What excercises will help me get that awesome stamina and power that Geoff Tate had when he was younger ? I' am also big Rob Halford and Dio fan but whenever I try to sing something heavy like "The Sentinel" my throat hurt badly and I am struggling with melody... thats (*auto edit*) up... It's really so hard to learn to sing in that style of music properly ?? Maybe there are some special recording tricks used to record heavy metal vocals ? I strongly believe I can learn but how long it will take I dont know... I dont wanna quit it beacouse I am addicted to it already... I just wanna to sound more PRO and stop being ashamed of mine own voice. Thanks i gotta chime in here... i don't mean to sound abrasive... and this is only directed at the folks who write in so "helpless." you folks all have these goals....you need to sing this way or that way, wanna sound like this guy or that guy, you have to improve on your terrible voice (you say it's terrible, not us) and all this and that. okay, we all do (and for the rest of our lives) fine. but please understand you have to do the work!! nobody's gonna hand it to you. you have to read and study, and sacrifice, exercise and sing, drink a lot of water....c'mon, sometimes it sounds to me like you guys think it's going to fall into your lap with this program, or this book. okay, you can't get or afford lessons? neither can a lot of us, but today you have all of these resources at your disposal, youtube, google, this online site, that online forum...please take advantage. i have to tell you, i'm on this forum to completely take advantage of all this knowledge and expertise, and i try in my own way to give back. but again, if your goal is to really get to a top-caliber level, you've got to work at this!! just do it! get started doing something! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyarlathotep Posted September 10, 2010 Author Share Posted September 10, 2010 i gotta chime in here... i don't mean to sound abrasive... and this is only directed at the folks who write in so "helpless." you folks all have these goals....you need to sing this way or that way, wanna sound like this guy or that guy, you have to improve on your terrible voice (you say it's terrible, not us) and all this and that. okay, we all do (and for the rest of our lives) fine. but please understand you have to do the work!! nobody's gonna hand it to you. you have to read and study, and sacrifice, exercise and sing, drink a lot of water....c'mon, sometimes it sounds to me like you guys think it's going to fall into your lap with this program, or this book. okay, you can't get or afford lessons? neither can a lot of us, but today you have all of these resources at your disposal, youtube, google, this online site, that online forum...please take advantage. i have to tell you, i'm on this forum to completely take advantage of all this knowledge and expertise, and i try in my own way to give back. but again, if your goal is to really get to a top-caliber level, you've got to work at this!! just do it! get started doing something! I am doing my own research on singing for years... I have (borrowed) singorama and that sls stuff Singing success, also Zen of screaming by Mellisa Cross But I have found that excersises in those programs are very VERY BORING... And that it dont work for vocals I am trying to copy/emulate... I dont even know how often I must do that escercises. When I did them I felt that I'am wasting time making all those noises that sounds stupid and unpleasant...(ney ney, , ma ,ma ,ma ,ma and other annoying shit like that). Now I've realized that some of those stupid excercises will help build my muscle memory and coordination(thanks to Kevin Richards he can explain everything in easy way !) I have tried Vendera ultimate workout too and I like it. I do excercises from his book when I'am not in mood to sing. Now I am watching lessons that Kevin Richards posted on youtube and so far lessons are very interesting to me... I will apply his excercises to my schedule... BTW not everyone have time to do non stop research, excercising, and singing. Some dude on youtube said that he is practicing singing 6 hrs a day and he really wanna be good in that but I cant spend that much time on just singing/excercising. There must be some kind of shorter more interesting and more effective way... Cmon... Geoff Tate and M. Kiske sounded OK when they were like 18. Surely they have more talent than they've putted work on excercises. Kiske didn't even take any lessons to be good... I dont need to be top proffesional vocalist and earn money while just singing... (that would be quite nice ..but.. its quite impossible) I just wanna sound GOOD on amateur (semi-pro)level... or just bit better... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VideoHere Posted September 10, 2010 Share Posted September 10, 2010 I am doing my own research on singing for years... I have (borrowed) singorama and that sls stuff Singing success, also Zen of screaming by Mellisa Cross But I have found that excersises in those programs are very VERY BORING... And that it dont work for vocals I am trying to copy/emulate... I dont even know how often I must do that escercises. When I did them I felt that I'am wasting time making all those noises that sounds stupid and unpleasant...(ney ney, , ma ,ma ,ma ,ma and other annoying shit like that). Now I've realized that some of those stupid excercises will help build my muscle memory and coordination(thanks to Kevin Richards he can explain everything in easy way !) I have tried Vendera ultimate workout too and I like it. I do excercises from his book when I'am not in mood to sing. Now I am watching lessons that Kevin Richards posted on youtube and so far lessons are very interesting to me... I will apply his excercises to my schedule... BTW not everyone have time to do non stop research, excercising, and singing. Some dude on youtube said that he is practicing singing 6 hrs a day and he really wanna be good in that but I cant spend that much time on just singing/excercising. There must be some kind of shorter more interesting and more effective way... Cmon... Geoff Tate and M. Kiske sounded OK when they were like 18. Surely they have more talent than they've putted work on excercises. Kiske didn't even take any lessons to be good... I dont need to be top proffesional vocalist and earn money while just singing... (that would be quite nice ..but.. its quite impossible) I just wanna sound GOOD on amateur (semi-pro)level... or just bit better... I dont even know how often I must do that escercises. When I did them I felt that I'am wasting time making all those noises that sounds stupid and unpleasant...(ney ney, , ma ,ma ,ma ,ma and other annoying shit like that). Now I've realized that some of those stupid excercises will help build my muscle memory and coordination(thanks to Kevin Richards he can explain everything in easy way !) what you wrote above is exactly how i felt. i promise you, no i will guarantee you, if you stick with exercising the voice in a consistent methodological way you will develop in ways you'd never imagine. i'm am so friggin' thrilled with my progress in the past 8 mos. i can't begin to tell you. stay with vendera's exercises if that's what you want, and alternate perhaps with others to alleviate the boredom. but you gotta stick with it to see the progress...remember i promised you...lol!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now