Rick Jones

I like them all, and I would have a tough time deciding which to use too, I like the flip but there i9s alot of emotion in a guy getting up there in his chest voice too.....I have similar dilemmas and I'm not near as good a singer as you, so it's good to know we are all affected!

Thankyou guys!!

Right...so this is curbing! Ok cool, now I always thought this was me pushing it, but I realise now that I hold air back when singing this way, I can do it clean too, and with a bit of experimenting tonight I found I can sing things this way I previously thought I was going to injure myself doing.

Thanks guys, now I am familiar with the sensation I can understand some of the terminology used!

....the chorus is about as high as I can comfortably get, without flipping over to that soft falsetto thing.

It doesn't hurt me, but it sounds strained, what do you make of it?

It's a live (one) take btw, guitar and vocals together.

Hey, Kelly is my ex-girlfriend, a good friend and former jamming partner(on the porch!)....she has an awesome voice, I think she is just looking for things to work on to allow her more control over it, and maybe expand range a little as I remember her being frustrated by notes in some cover songs (Allison Krauss if I remember correctly).

We currently reside at opposite sides of the Atlantic, and I haven't heard her in person for years.

Hope you don't mind me posting that Kell!:)

Wow Geno, I love your vibrato, seems effortless for you too!

Very impressive!

I don't think the link is showing, at least on my browser. :)

Guitartrek, thanks for the video link, I found that very helpful with the terminology!

mvrasseli, thankyou very much!

'chele......thankyou for the advice, and also for the kindness, I will remain me, hopefully just a more in control of my voice version!:)

I would also suggest checking Robert Lunte's youtube channel. He sings and uses the techniques he teaches. I think you will find that he has the pedagogy to get you where you want to go.

My first memory of Chris Cornell is of course with the break-out hit "Loud Love" from his days with Sonic Garden. That opening piercing wail, nearly guaranteed to shatter glass. But I think he modernly uses curbing and some crying resonance. As well as does Eddie Vedder.

When I hear the late Layne Staley and the current singer, William Duvall, I hear twanging, even though the band was marketed as grunge, I still think of them as a hard rock group, with maybe some grunge song stylings. But I also think of Pearl Jam (with Eddie Vedder) as hard rock that happened to be labeled grunge. And that is also Vedder's viewpoint. Especially from his own perspective as seen in the episode of "Iconoclasts" when talking with his friend, surfer Laird Hamilton. I think a number of hard rock bands that didn't immediately slap on the glam or "hair metal" fashions were unfairly labelled grunge and record companies were directing record producers to give the songs a "grunge" feel, trying to capitalize on the Nirvana momentum.

Oh I totally agree, Pearl Jam were/are a hard rock band, and Alice in Chains were something all of their own in those days.

I am newish to the terminology, but if twang be the witches cackle/axl rose sound, then I hear alot of that in Layne. When I do this sound it's hideous/comedic....but I like it in singers like Layne. Is this sound something anyone could learn to harness? I can see uses for it in the occasional phrase.

I don't want to sound like these guys per se, just to be able to incorporate some elements of those techniques and have a freer voice.

Chris Cornell does some pretty darn high notes in seemingly chest voice....I am unfamiliar with the term "curbing", is this a way he is doing them?

My Dad had a huge country/bluegrass/old timey kind of record collection when I was young...if anything my own voice seems to follow this rather than the music I chose in my teens.....funny how it works.

Are the people you're listening to doing the same style as you? If so.....ok.

I'm thinking that you could accomplish 90% of your goal by focusing a little bit on phrasing. Make the words flow a bit better. Connect the sounds a bit more and hold the notes a bit longer at the end of your sentences.

Try that and see how it changes things.

Hmm, well, I don't really listen to music (or know of any) that sounds alot like I do....I'm very much a grunge/rock/metal guy when it comes to listening....my own music has come out completely differently to what I personally like, maybe as a result of being a solo performer.

But singers I love are guys like Chris Cornell, Layne Staley, The guy from Shinedown, Eddie Vedder.

The only one I have any vague idea of being able to sing is Mr. Vedder, not that I worry about sounding "like" them, but I sound very amateur in comparison I feel.

I will concentrate on phrasing, thankyou for the advice...I am aware my accent makes the vowels abrubt and guttral, and am working on how to change that without "faking and accent"....but I find that hard.....how do you guys keep your own voice whilst smoothing out the vowel sounds?

I know alot of Southern singers have already that singsong kind of tone just when speaking,as do Italians, which gives them lovely sounding vowels to sing with. Short of emulating the accent I don't know how to do this myself.

I will absolutely try and hold the notes as you say, maybe what I am hearing is this and hadn't realised, thankyou Michelle!

Wow! Excellent performances. I love your guitar work and you voice fits perfectly with your style - both songs. You don't really need to do anything with your voice if you don't want to - you are a natural. But if your are interested in improving your voice you've come to the right place. For one, if you want to sing full voice up another octave (in addition to your falsetto singing) you can do that. You'll need to learn to sing through your passagio (E4 to Ab4) and there is a "trick" to learning how do do that.

An easy improvement is this: Try smiling while you sing. You'll add some brightness to your tone by raising and energizing the cheekbones.

Thankyou again for the kindness!! I appreciate the time to listen, and glad you like my playing, as a fellow guitarist!

A natural?? Really?? Wow...I would have thought myself to be in need of much work to be passable!! That's very encouraging, thankyou!!

The advice on smiling is very good, even trying it here whilst playing I feel what you mean, and brightness is definately something I was seeking in my tone.

I definately want to improve though, I'd like to be more versatile....and even if I rarely used it, to have the high range in reserve, as well as I'm sure it will help my overall singing.

I am going to purchase Robert Lunte system soon, and work with that, and it is nice to know I can talk to others with experience on this forum!

Thankyou again and I wish healthy happy singing to all!!

Wow, thanks guys, I really wasn't expecting that, and thanks for the kind words on my music!

Michelle, I don't reall have any songs where I use a higher register for longer, as I still haven't learned to comfortably use it.... my head voice is kind of fluety and falsetto sounding, and very different from my usual singing...and I haven't really learned how to render it useable.

If I sing in the more relaxed way, as on exit ramp, it is closer to sounding similar, I intend to figure it out and expand my range upward, but my speaking voice is naturally fairly deep and my lowest usable note is around the same as the low E on my guitar.

What I'd like to achieve is a freer voice, to be able to go up and down pitches more smoothly,and also to tail off my notes better, they sound very "cut off" and abrupt/germanic (if that makes sense) to me when I compare them to other singers I like.

Thanks guys for taking the time out to listen, and any advice would be gratefully recieved.

:)

I have always been a guitarist first and a singer second, but I have wanted to change that for a long while.

I went to a group lesson with some singers from a local harmony group, which is absolutely different from my usual way of singing....I've always chased a rock vocal kind of tone, but the guys there said I sounded very much nicer and more in control of pitch when I sang in a quiter more relaxed manner.

Here are two original songs of mine, one recorded before this advice, and one since;

"Exit Ramp" is the more relaxed vocal, I wasn't "trying" in any sense that I'm used to to sing, just kind of sing/talking,which felt odd to me (I think my nose sounds blocked on M and N sounds on here);

"Eden" is my more usual way of singing;

If you have time, would you please add any advice or comment you feel is appropriate, and if I am onto the right track as a vocalist by relaxing more?

Thanks in advance,

Rick

Thankyou for taking the time, both to listen and offer such a useful critique!

I have always been a guitar player foremost, and until fairly recent times, never really worried too much about my singing voice.....I'm going to change that though.

I have been told often by laypeople that I have "loads of power", but I'm starting to realise that this isn't nessicarily a good attribute, since I have currently no idea how to use it, or even if I should.

I am intending to pick up some learning material soon as funds allow, and hopefully I can figure out "using my diaphragm", as currently, the only way I can seem to connect my mind with it is belly breathing......talk of "downwards support" etc is currently a foriegn concept, as I have no idea what it would feel like.

For finding that "inner breath", is there anyway to experience this without visiting a singing tutor?

I have recentley started doing lip rolls and "ngg" excercises to try and feel that resonance I read about, but that aside I have no clue about the training methods.

I must add, I live on a 9x5miles island, off the coast of France, although governed by the UK, and the only local singing teacher is a theatre group leader, who wouldn't teach me unless I would join the drama group (there aren't alot of members), and I literally don't have time to spare him for that, let alone the urge to wear tights!!

Thankyou again for the time you took to advise me, it will be taken onboard and hopefully used to improve myself.

Rick

....does it sound to you like I am pushing in a manner dangerous to my vocal chords?

I sing in this manner often, and the only time I ever lost my voice or got a sore throat was when I did band gigs without a monitor....but I was told recentley that I may end up with nodules if I use my voice this way.

It was a quick vid, done shortly after I rose from bed, whilst my kids hadn't yet got up (only time I ever get to make vids!), and I will embed a version by the original artist underneath...my aim was for a similar sound without the original artists machine gun vibrato, as a demo for a friend overseas.

Here is me;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Zb-ibHcosI

Here is Jake Smith (the White Buffalo);

I did it from memory, so note choices and tempo may differ.

I know I have a long way to go voice wise, but any criticism would be used to improve myself!

Also feel free to listen to my myspace for some idea of my own music....I tend not to sing as low as on the video.