Enander

So, I've been trying to develop my softer voice, and what did I do? I chose a hit single from the 16th century!

It's commonly sung very operatic, but I don't really want that (like I could accomplish that anyway) because I can't see it befitting the rest of my vocal repertoire. I begin very softly in a falsetto-kind-of-voice and goes into a thicker voice later on (but no grit whatsoever!).

https://soundcloud.com/rednane-kirderf/flowmytears

And yeah, I had a little mucus in my throat during "forlorn", but what the hey!

Also, I got a bit cocky at the end and tried to pull a Jussi Björling (but failed), but it felt good before that so I settled! Haha!

Now, after hearing Chavie do a good performance of the song, I felt I just had to sing Rainbow in dark (it's a compliment to him and his singing)!

I do it from time to time to see my progression (it's one the songs I use a mean to measure my skills). Needless to say, still a long way to go! Haha!

Well, I guess a little more practice on this particular song would probably straighten out some flaws, instead of just jumping right into the fire.

https://www.box.com/s/ilbkplv5qkgv2n3rrldx

I think the most notable mistakes I did was when singing "someone" (totally lost it), which made me reserved so I went overboard with the heady characteristics of my mixed voice during "words" instead... and you can hear one of the most common swedish profanities there is, "fan", at the end before I give up! :D

I hold Rainbow in the dark as one of the toughest songs to sing well (as far as metal goes) and one of the most treacherous.

Dio's voice put a shroud of deception over it with his thick and powerful voice, making it feel "lower" and more approachable than it really is. Then avarage Joe (I don't mean you) comes along, tries to sing it and wound up sounding like a little girl, or get fatigued within the first verse.

With that being said, you did very good! I can't give you any tips though, because I can't do better.

Hats off!

ronws

Nice to hear!

Jugulator

Thanks! I'm not sure what you mean by forced, but it takes a lot of force to sustain adequate support so you don't hurt yourself. I guess some of that applied force will influence the timbre.

Jeff Abbey

Thank you, Jeff! To be honest, I thought it would be tough, but it went smoother than expected! Haha! :)

Always loved this tracked

You did a great job dude.......russel allan is a monster,and you handled this very well !!!

I stumbled upon it recently and fell in love with it right there and then, and yes, Allen sure is a monster! Easily one of the best!

And thank you very much for the comliment, Chavie! :D

So, diction and timing has been my lesson since last time (aside my eternal lesson of singing a bit softer).

I picked another "earphone-breaker" to escape the clutches of singing softer though, but I really tried to do my timing and diction well!

I'm usually not the one to blow my own horn, but the overall sound got a bit better by focusing on that instead of pitch. The pitch actually came along!

I'm not saying that the pitch is perfect or that I'm some metronomic diction-God, but I feel like I've started to handle tools which will take my singing to another level.

Also, there's a threshold where the singing goes from bad to good, and this kind of approach have reduced the time for me to reach that threshold! Therefore, I'd like to thank those who pointed out that I had to focus on this, and those who helped me to get some ideas how to get there!

*Snip* Got a better and longer version! :)

Jens I have no problem just talking, and try to get perspective of things! It's the whole thing of me singing and someone telling me what to do that doesn't resonate well with me for some reason.

Sounds like a nice goal, and I'm sure there are loads of people which are more susceptible to that kind of learning than I am.

Your last assessment was spot on, so I'd be happy if you'd keep giving me some feedback, whenever you like it, when I upload something!

ronws Haha! I don't mind tough love!

While I stand by my comment (the toughest of tough love is the one I bring onto myself ), I do understand that it may act as an impediment. But, at the same time, big room for improvement is even a big room of possibilities.

One step in the right direction regarding my clean voice will probably take me farther than one step in the right direction regarding my grittier voice (seeing as it's more developed, and the changes are probably more incremental).

As far as autodidacticism goes, I may not the be the best example of it, but I like it. A great deal in my passion that is singing is (while listening to what other vocalists have to say/browsing through seemingly endless theory) to discern my own way. I know where I want to go, even if I at the time don't know how to get there. Skimming through one or two articles, discussing it with someone and experimentation usually helps me off to a good start at least.

Sure, I might have reinvented the wheel more than once, but I don't mind I see it more as a sign that I'm capable of learning things properly on my own.

if you want to you can add me to skype, i can help you work this song to perfection. Ive got great experience recording, me and a friend have recorded several hundred songs

skype:jensviktorjohansson

I really appreciate the suggestion , but I've had someone analysing my voice and corrected it on the spot before and it wasn't my cup of tea actually :/ I did as I was instructed, but it never really stuck. Felt almost like I was some robot executing commands, nothing more.

I sure like advice, tips and pointers (otherwise I wouldn't be here), but in the end I have to work through things in my own pace, find my own way and have my own revelations to make things stick.

I mean, I often know I should do this and that, but, if it's only "shallow knowledge", I won't remember to incorporate it when I'm actually singing.

Awsome job man!

I think this was both the best and the worst I've heard from you (and by worst, it's still very enjoyable mind you). On your high screams you have an awsome sound but most of all it sounds like you are alot more confident there. Find that confidence in the softer places and they will sound alot better too.

All of the "issues" (again, MINOR details) you already have the technique to fix, it's just choices of vowels, pronounciations and timing. Fix those and this is pro level imo.

Very nice job!

Cheers!

Thank you! To be frank, I'm a little bit more happy for the "worst I've heard"-remark, because that means I could get out of this a little better!

I'm weak in regards of pronunciation/enunciation, but I don't really know how to fix it.

It might be connected to your first point; confidence. In the lower register I have very little of it, and I put all of my focus on being on pitch as much as I can. However, I guess better pronunciation/enunciation might help me be on pitch easier.

If anyone has some more in-depth pointers concerning pronunciation/enunciation, please feel free to potter up a message!

As far as timing goes, it's just me not knowing the song well enough and being undisciplined; not staying the course. I tend to be spontaneous and screw things up Were it the "real deal", I'd definitely follow my game plan though.

So, I said I was going to post something more dynamic/melodic!

Here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GNGxiWnh3g

For being a fraud (not being able to actually sing, just "grit" and scream my way through any song) I think I did a pretty good job. Haha! Jokes aside, I wasn't born with a pleasant sound on my voice, so it's hard for me to sing like this because I think I sounds like crap whatever I do. Haha!

As usual, type whatever you feel like! :)

ronws It's good to discuss vocals with people that understand just that! My father believes Dio was the apex of heavy metal singing and despises my rendition of Don't talk to strangers because I didn't sound like Dio. Haha! He even "advised" me to take it off the internet to save me the humiliation.

I agree with you wholeheartedly; every voice is different and reacts more or less differently to stimuli.

Lord_Adōn Haha! Actually, it's on my to-do list for my Youtube channel! :D

Vafan, hade redan både Jens och Max som andra svenskar som förnedrar mig här på forumet, så kommer det en till som är lika bra! :-)

Du har en grym röst enander och/men jag håller med Jens "kritik". Det är ju dock som han säger, andra val snarare än teknikfel. Ska bli kul att få höra en dynamisk låt, tror det blir skitbra :-)

Haha! Äsch!! ...men vänta nu, Max är väl inte svensk? Fast vi kanske inte tänker på samma Max!

Om jag ska vara ärlig så tycker jag att klippet (into the pit) är lite pinsamt! Haha!

Hursomhelst; ja, nästa gång ska jag ladda upp nåt mer dynamiskt!

Well as both an good singer and a metalfan ive gotta say your heavy mix and rockfalsetto are top notch. your weakness doesnt lie in these two coordinations. What i mean and wanted to point out is not you copying jorns or kellys technique but rather try to make the same choices

technique is not your weakpart, i see it more like:

Imagine you had this very fast formula 1 car, now your giving the keys to a guy who just got his driverslicense.

Thats how you drive your voice, more like " I wonder how fast this car can go today, wow still that fast!now il drive this fast all the time".

What you need to do is learn to handle the car like a proffesional racingdriver, it will still be the same car but still o so diffrent.

Im not blaming you, im giving you these tips because im just like you in that regard, just look some vids in my youtube channel and youl see lol

I know it's hard holding back when you know you can hit that note alittle higher or alittle more powerfull

Yeah, I understand, and I agree! Haha! Thanks for your time/help, Jens! Appreciate it!

Först och främst, jävligt skoj med ett litet klipp!

För det andra, du har helt rätt! Detta, förutom pitchen, har varit mitt största problem sedan start, och det är nog som du säger; att jag är tvungen att börja lyssna på andra. Jag har hittills inte lyssnat så mycket på andra i syfte att anamma deras stil/tekniker. Jag har försökt hitta mina egna grejer/vägar att gå (givetvis är det svårt att inte höra nåt och ta efter, men du fattar nog vad jag menar).

Med det sagt, nu var detta en fråga om just mina två "extremröster" om man vill kalla dem så, och jag ville visa upp dem. Detta är den punkt då min röst är som fulast/sämst (bortsett från de extremt låga och visselregistret), och jag kan inte få det bättre än såhär, vilket är frustrerande.

Jag tänkte skriva att jag hade valt en annan ansats vid en "vanlig" låt, men jag valde ju att göra Dio - Don't talk to strangers (som är en väldigt mjuk låt i början) rätt hård, så du har, som sagt, väldigt rätt och de två problematikerna flyter in i varandra.

Väldigt tacksam för input! Jag ska ta en dynamisk låt och sjunga den som den ska sjungas, så att säga.

Tack!

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In english:

First of all, it's very nice to get a clip as a respons!

Secondly, you are absolutely right! This, apart from my pitch, has been my biggest problem since the beginning, and I probably should start listen to other vocalists. Up 'till now, I haven't really been listening to other vocalists in order to find inspiration. I've tried to find my own way, but of course there's been hard not to embrace something if you hear it and like it (it's just been less consciously).

With that being said, I made this topic for my two "extreme voices", if you will, and I wanted to put them up on display. This is the point where my voice is its ugliest/worst (apart from the extremely low and whistle register), but I can't seem to get better than this, which is frustrating.

I was going to say that I would have used a different onset if it were a "normal" song, but since my rendition of Dio - Don't talk to strangers is rather rough even in places it shouldn't, I probably wouldn't. So, again, you're correct in your assessment and the problems are probably closely related.

I'm very grateful for your input! Next, I'm going to find a dynamic song and sing it like it's supposed to be sung.

Thanks! :)

Är du svensk ?

Ja, jag tror det!

I need some help with this one!

I've recorded myself with two "different voices" in the same notes, but I'm not really happy with any of them!

The first one is a very chesty, powerful mixed voice, and it's a natural way to extend my "normal" voice, but it sounds too strained and "yelly". It wears me out rather quickly (as you'll hear at the end of the first verse) because it requires a massive support not to lose the timbre.

The second voice is more "halford-esque". It doesn't require as much support and the return (low input in relation to output) is great! I mean, it sounds raw even if you're singing slightly above talking-volume. However, the difference between this voice and my "normal" voice is too big, and I'm treading a razor's edge. One slip and I'll hurt myself, which is why I didn't start with the grit, but worked up to.

A bit higher, in regards to key, I naturally use more of my halford-esque timbre, but it's the crucial transation-point (where my two voices meet) that's problematic. I can't seem to integrate the two different voices more than this...

https://soundcloud.com/rednane-kirderf/intothepit (It's pitchy and I don't know the lyrics. Just listen to the timbres)

Don't mind the laughter. I was bored and thought it was a funny way to change the timbre! Haha!

Any tips/thoughts? Everything is welcome, except "shut up and enjoy the fact you can choose like this" :P

says it's blocked in my country (USA.)

I make fun of myself. I just about always get applause when I perform for people. Except the one time my wife asked me to stop and it was not because I was off-key.

One of my wife's favorites was Dan Fogelberg, who passed away from prostate cancer. His favorite song of his own and her favorite song, too, was "Leader of the Band."

I finally got around to learning that song and I was doing it, in the original key, and nailing it. And that was the problem. She started crying and asked me to stop, it was bringing back too many memories.

But I may have to record it, at least for my own collection. It really is a pretty song and I like it, too.

Ah, right! It was a Queen live recording. Freddie was a little out of shape, but still made a huge impact!

Haha! The power of singing, right there! :D

That's how the cookie crumbles! Well done!

Sounds like a more thrashy version of Udo Dirkschneider!

Good point. I had not thought of the artistic freedom that I have. Since I am a middle-aged working joe, I have a job, part of what is necessary to maintain a house. So, I don't have a record deal or some inflexible public demanding I sing this or that. I do have a dog and a cat and they are my helpless captive audience, for now.

I have sang in front of others, family, friends, general public, usually to applause or, at least, a lack of booing and "you stink" and whatever else.

I think they're just being polite because of my intimidating appearance.

I value my artistic freedom very much; be it music, literature or art, and I will not let anything limit it (in the long run)

Haha! And I think you're too hard on yourself! Even if a singer does something "wrong", he/she can touch the listener's heart. Conviction and, as I usually say, a connection between heart and vocal cords will take a singer a looong way. Case in point:

ronws Haha! As much as I love singing, I don't fancy touring. I've turned down a few offers (some bands had quite good record deals too actually) because their touring plan was too hectic.

I've sacrificed an enormous amount of time and energy (and sadly, health and sanity) to be where I am academically, and I'm not willing to give that up. Also, singing is a big part of my, oh so well-needed, recreation. I don't want to risk turning it to a "job", where I'm burdened with even more demands and "have to":s.

Lord_Adōn Hey, Adon! Thank you very much! It's nice getting a compliment from you!

In 1988, when i first started developing full voice volume in my upper range, I lived in a condo in Dallas. Our neighbors were newlyweds. And nearly every night, I could not help but hear them celebration their new marriage.

And so, every early evening, they got to hear me shriek and hit some bad notes loud enough to break glass.

Outside in the parking lot, we would simply say hi and bye, depending on arrival or departure. The neighbors on the other side bought a loud stereo and liked dance music. So, I would turn up my Fender 85 amp (200 watts, rms) and give a little "Snakeskin Cowboy" or "Cat Scratch Fever" from ole' Ted Nugent. No complaints there, either.

Ah, good times ....

Now, I live in a house on a 1/4 acre and can do what I want. Two houses down from lives a drummer who practices in his garage. Over that last year or so, he and his band are finally starting to gel.

So, the solution to your problems is to have polite neighbors such as I have had.

Haha! Nice!

It's a matter of give and take, I guess!

Also, I long for the possibility to have a house. Would be great to have a little recording studio.

Hahahahha, did i hear the neighbour upstairs stomp their feet or was it you? Even though i have a house neighbours complained so i had to go down to the basement, hahahha. Anyway, what else can i say, you sing heavy metal like a God, your grit is fantastic. I hope you are not homeless now, hahahha.

Haha! You know what, it just might be! When it's silent in our appartment, we can hear our neighbours' conversations. That's how badly the sound proofing is.

Alas (?), no one has said anything about my singing; no angry notes or something.

Hm! Maybe I should make a clip where I blow my lungs out. No actual singing, just high pitched shrieks for 10 minutes... in the middle of the night... during the upcoming finals week!

(EDIT: My neighbours tend to party loudly every Thursday to Saturday until 4 or 5 AM, piss and/or vomit everywhere, and destroy property. So this whole thing of me singing is far from gratuitous!)

Also, thank you for the compliment! I needed that, as I was on the brink of developing a full-blown case of "study rage".

Great singing man! My neighbour also hates me because the walls are so thin that he can hear me talking normally on the phone, let alone practising high notes.

Just wanted to mention something that kinda bugged me, I felt like you were rushing the tempo on both songs, singing the phrase a fraction of second before it felt right. Maybe its just me. But anyways, awesome voice !

Thanks!

Yeah, same here! I don't practice at home though. I drive out into the woods. It's not so bad... unless it's -20°C (-4ºF) or below.

And thank you for telling me what buggers you! I'll look into it.

FelipeCarvalho

Thank you very much!

I've not personally "encountered" you on these forum before, but I know you're straight forward when it comes to critique (for the record, that's how I like it). Feels good to get a few kind words from someone that's not afraid to tell it like it is!

Max

Hey, Max! Good to hear from you again, and thanks!

I hope you'll find the time and inspiration to get some singing done soon! :)

You should try "Breaking the Law" the live version from Germany. This is from 1983. It's my favorite performance of this song, even better than the album or the video.

I had something else planned next, but I think I'm gonna change my mind. You have made me curious. Haha!

Thank you very much for the tip, ronws!

Did you sleep with any of em?

Haha! No, I was/am way too ugly for that! :cool: