I want to know what love is(Foreigner)

[aravindmadis]

Hi Ronws,Geetnap,BHB,Adoney,Wabba_trends, MDEW and other good folks...

Please check out and give feedback.. I have recorded a video this time.. Please see if you can spot some glitches in my technique.. The video was recorded after the audio, so it is meant to be an illustration of my singing technique, so please ignore the sync issues!!

This song is kind of my personal mount everest.. I have been trying to sing this for the past 1 year and now I feel confident about posting a version..

There are days that I just can't pull this off.. What do I need to improve my consistency?

[Muzikant]

Very good Next time punch mic stronger you dont need mic

Only suggestion ,high note in the end doesn't sound very impressive,so IMO it should be louder and more poferfull(I am sure that you can do that).This is hard song,do you have any vocal leesons or you are natural talent?

[Gneetapp]

Hey man, very good job! Now you got to explain to me how come "there are days you just can't pull it off..."? You made look and sound as if it was easy for you, and I believe it was, as my good old friend Ronws always says, "singing is mental".

Let me tell you, in the first "In my life..." (1:15min) you didn't sound so good. However, in the second and longest one, you just nailed it perfectly! But started the "I want to know..." a bit weaker (probably out of breath), but still good. Were you singing the high pitch parts with a light head mixed voice, or belting mixed voice?

I don't know what to say, it seems to me that you just need practice, you can sing all the notes, just relax, feel the song, and be very aware and in control throughout the whole song. Well, at least that is what I've been doing lately with the songs that used to be pitch challenging to me, and now that I can sing all the notes (or at least 99.9% of the notes) I'm trying to sing the song with the highest level of awareness I can, which brings to my attention possible issues with breath support, or uneven resonance throughout parts of the song.

Keep on Rocking! :cool:

[MDEW]

It sounded pretty solid to me. There may have been a few spots that could have used more confidence. No need to fear it now. :cool:

[The Aspiring Singer]

That was a pretty good rendition! You have a voice that's very similar to the original, and it is well within your range.

I would say that the biggest thing to work on is getting the support lower. It seems like your breathing is shallow, engaging only the upper half of your lungs. This is evident throughout the sustained longer notes, when tension starts to creep into the sound. During the longer notes, keep the breath low. It is also really apparent when you get to the ad lib section towards the end of the song.

Also related - while I appreciate your expressiveness and your ease in moving while you sing, sometimes it gets in the way of keeping your breathing mechanism engaged. As an experiment, try keeping your feet planted firmly into the ground. Think of digging your heels deep into the ground (but keep your knees relaxed) on phrases like "I wanna FEEL what love is" and really dig down on the word "feel." Try to keep the easiness of your posture without shifting your weight side to side.

I would also lower the microphone. Its current height further encourages a shallower breathing. Maybe lower it to about chin level.

Overall, you have a very easy way about your sound. It seems like it's effortless, which is a good thing. But it tends towards the "too easy" almost lazy side of your sound. (I hope that doesn't sound rude.) It needs more strength behind it, and that comes from good breath support. You don't want to swing too much to the other side and start getting tension, but you will have to work to find balance.

To get more consistent just takes practice. Just make sure that you're practicing the right way. As it stands right now, with your current lack of support, more practice would probably lead to the bad kind of tension in your vocal cords and you would lose your voice more easily. If you sing with better support, you'll be able to sing for longer periods of time.

Here is one of my blog posts in which I offer 7 tricks for better breath support: http://www.theaspiringsinger.com/betterbreathsupport/

I think you would really benefit by trying some of the exercises that I posted.

Good luck and keep up the good work!

[aravindmadis]

Very good Next time punch mic stronger you dont need mic

Only suggestion ,high note in the end doesn't sound very impressive,so IMO it should be louder and more poferfull(I am sure that you can do that).This is hard song,do you have any vocal leesons or you are natural talent?

Thank you.. The high note is a mixing error.. It was way too loud and just did not sit in the mix correctly. I do these recordings at home and I am just learning to use a DAW correctly, looks like I made it too soft and used more reverb than required here..

I have never had a vocal lesson, and I live in India where it is not possible to get vocal lessons for the style of songs that I like to sing. So while you can say I am a "natural talent", it will convey only half the story. I work very hard and practise regularly. And I try to get as much feedback and to be honest, I have got a lot of help on this board. I would not be half the singer I am today without this help.

[aravindmadis]

Gneetapp, I have always visualized singing as a physical co-ordination and the whole "visualize the note before you sing" is something that I tend to struggle with. I have always felt that singing should not involve strain and maybe I tend to mentally relax a little too much(which I guess is counterproductive, unlike relaxing physically, which actually helps a great deal). After all these songs are pretty hard and looks like I need to work on my mental aspects as hard as I work on my technique..

About your question, I am not sure what I am doing here. I am definitely using a mixed voice and all notes I have tried to sing with power, so I think it is definitely a mixed voice belt.. Is it harmful for vocal chords.. Have heard belting is bad, but I guess if you don't push from chest(which I am not doing here), it should be okay??

[aravindmadis]

That was a pretty good rendition! You have a voice that's very similar to the original, and it is well within your range.......

Good luck and keep up the good work!

Wow.. Thank you for such a detailed feedback. I am really humbled about the similarity in my voice with Lou's. I never thought of it that way and Lou is a great role model for his singing technique and versatality..

Never thought movement and mic position would be the cause behind some of my issues, infact I have never thought much about breathing at all, so thanks a lot for this feedback and I will definitely try out the exercises.

I have always tried to go deeper when trying to sing high notes. I don't know how to explain it, but it's like a well, my mental imagery is that the higher the note the deeper I have to dig. The lack of punch in "I wanna FEEL what love is" is mostly due to laziness and in retrospect, definitely breathing issues..

[aravindmadis]

This brings me to something I am curious about. Am I a tenor?

These are the characteristics of my voice

- I struggle a lot with the lowest notes(like for e.g. in Silent Lucidity, I just cannot seem to sing the intro). In fact the lowest notes in this song(think it is a Bb2) is I think about as low as I can sing and even here I cannot sing any louder

- I like to sing in the headvoice and prefer to bridge down than bridge from below and like Ronws would say, go lighter as you descend and allow strong chest muscles to take over. I never knew one could do this till a couple of months ago, yet, this is now my preferred singing style and I can't believe I haven't been singing like this all my life.

- I am most comfortable bridging early if I have to bridge, although I prefer to avoid bridging altogether if I can by being in the head voice.

- I can belt in a chesty sounding notes upto a C5(for e.g. the "We'll keep on FIIIIGHTINNGGGGGGG, in the song "we are the champions"), albeit not with a high degree of consistency..Based on this song, my highest non modal note is F#5 & I think I can go higher

I know that the vocal Fach is only indicative and not a rule. I think I can sing these songs with more confidence if I know I am tenor(even a low tenor). As a kid, I listened and sung Indian music, which had mostly bass/baritonal range, so maybe psychologically, somehow I still have a bit of trepidation when I approach songs in the true tenor range.

[The Aspiring Singer]

You are definitely a tenor! One can hear that just by listening to the timbre of your voice and the ease with which you sing the notes in the range that you sing.

[Gneetapp]

Gneetapp, I have always visualized singing as a physical co-ordination and the whole "visualize the note before you sing" is something that I tend to struggle with. I have always felt that singing should not involve strain and maybe I tend to mentally relax a little too much(which I guess is counterproductive, unlike relaxing physically, which actually helps a great deal). After all these songs are pretty hard and looks like I need to work on my mental aspects as hard as I work on my technique..

About your question, I am not sure what I am doing here. I am definitely using a mixed voice and all notes I have tried to sing with power, so I think it is definitely a mixed voice belt.. Is it harmful for vocal chords.. Have heard belting is bad, but I guess if you don't push from chest(which I am not doing here), it should be okay??

I read from several sources that belting is not bad for your voice, as long as you are doing it properly. I used to scream/yell my way up to G4-G#4, and on the next day I would be hoarse and could not sing. Now, I passed my first barrier, and have been practicing rock songs with a much higher top range (D5-F5), and I can do it day after day with no hoarseness. One of the "tricks" is to build the voice musculature, use twang up high, and support, so you don't have to push/force the sound, which is more damaging to my voice than belting. Now, as I told you, I've been practicing to make it more consistent and fuller/thicker up high, while been trying to improve my range up to G5. Feel free to check my progress here in this cover practice http://themodernvocalist.punbb-hosting.com/viewtopic.php?id=10099

It is not as good as yours, but you get the sense of what I'm talking about.

Cheers and Keep on Rocking! :cool:

[ronws]

Confidence is a good word. And I noticed a few wobbly notes and I think it was from not letting the note get in the head.

Also, it looks like your tongue sticks out at times. Let the tongue rest and don't worry so much about articulation. For example, in american english, the word "the" is made to start with the tongue against the upper teeth. But, in singing, I am more likely to let the tongue approach the upper teeth barely from behind, if that much.

And I absolutely applaud you using the oo sound in the word, "love." Where I live, we tend to pronounce that uh sound as an uh sound. In our dialect, it involves a dropped tongue and sound spilling out of the mouth. I had to go to oo to correct that for singing, as well.

So, you are doing good things with vowels. I would just say, let the notes, especially the higher ones, get in the head easier.

And much applause for taking on a difficult song. It spends most of its time in the passagio.

[aravindmadis]

You are definitely a tenor! One can hear that just by listening to the timbre of your voice and the ease with which you sing the notes in the range that you sing.

Oh! All this while, I have been HOPING to sing these songs, blaming my difficulties on a lower voice and not recognizing the technical glitches(like breath support).. Maybe I should now EXPECT to sing songs in this range and it makes a difference in the way I think and approach these songs.. I was practicing last night, and I could feel an immediate improvement(small yet perceptible) when I started thinking, yeah.. it's in my range.. I can do it..

RonWs, can you please elaborate when you say "let the notes, especially the higher ones, get in the head easier".. What does "get in the head" mean? This song outside of the intro, is entirely on my passagio! I was always under the impression that for Lou it might not be in the passagio for his voice and that's why he makes it look so easy!

Love this forum and the passion that everyone here has for singing.. Thanks again folks..

[The Aspiring Singer]

I'm so glad that you were able to notice an improvement when you changed your thinking! Good for you!

[ronws]

Oh! All this while, I have been HOPING to sing these songs, blaming my difficulties on a lower voice and not recognizing the technical glitches(like breath support).. Maybe I should now EXPECT to sing songs in this range and it makes a difference in the way I think and approach these songs.. I was practicing last night, and I could feel an immediate improvement(small yet perceptible) when I started thinking, yeah.. it's in my range.. I can do it..

RonWs, can you please elaborate when you say "let the notes, especially the higher ones, get in the head easier".. What does "get in the head" mean? This song outside of the intro, is entirely on my passagio! I was always under the impression that for Lou it might not be in the passagio for his voice and that's why he makes it look so easy!

Love this forum and the passion that everyone here has for singing.. Thanks again folks..

A few times, it sounded like a strain, like you were squeezing to get the note out. I wanted to see if it would be easier for you if you, instead of worrying about adduction of the folds, rather more concentrated on where the note should live, instead of where it started.

[wabba_treads]

Wow nice job man! Keep on doing what you're doing, because if you can even sing that song in tune without wearing yourself out, much singing it passionately, you're doing something right! I would just add a little bit more grit towards the end though to give it that signature "punch" but only if you can do it in a safe way.

Congratulations! :)

[aravindmadis]

Wow nice job man! Keep on doing what you're doing, because if you can even sing that song in tune without wearing yourself out, much singing it passionately, you're doing something right! I would just add a little bit more grit towards the end though to give it that signature "punch" but only if you can do it in a safe way.

Congratulations!

THanks Wabba.. What is grit and how do I add it to my tone?

[wabba_treads]

What I meant by grit is that really slight rasp or distortion that Lou Gramm uses to add the "bluesiness" and color to the song. Listen carefully when he does the F#5 and the F5 and even the B4s in the bridge "IN my life" you can hear a little bit of rasp there.

As for how to add it for yourself, I am not the best person to ask because I'm still trying to find my own "sweet spot" for adding rasp without hurting myself

I would recommend taking a little lesson for that with a vocal coach near you or the many coaches that offer online Skype lessons right here at the forum like Rob Lunte, Daniel Formica, Phil Moufarrege and many others.