analog

aka, re-listened to your old sample of the "bad" distortion. Can definitely hear night and day difference in the "centering" of the tone. Just curious what you worked on to get the centered healthy sounding tone in your samples above(even the two distortions clips sound very centered.) Could be a big help to people who are interested in this genre(and having trouble with it.)

Most definitely #4 and #1 for me too. Awesome man!

F' yeah brother!

Good deal Bob! Worst case scenario(with CVT) is you'll continue to expand your vocal knowledge base. Not talking "Yoda Steve" knowledge, but it might help you to better understand some of the other methods you own. You already have an excellent foundation, so no reason to throw the baby out with the bath water(or however that goes.)

Just incredible man!

@Jens: I find that hard to believe. You've built a huge voice. Curbing has been my feckin' nemesis from day one. I finally figured out how to sing everything from the "same" place...meaning I will Curb, OD and Edge through the hold(or at least through a "similar feeling" compressed state.) One other video that really got me thinking "outside the box" was a YT vid you posted on Jorn Lande: (Especially starting at :19) You can really hear how much sub-glottic pressure he uses. I mean, regardless of mode, he compresses and NEVER lets up. Was a real light bulb moment for me. @Geno: thanks for your input...your demos are absolutely amazing! Just listened to 'The Wall.' Wow. @Bob: I think you captured Sting's timbre way better than me...but to my ears, Sting "mostly" sings in a Curbed/Mixed voice. Just leans to the lighter side of it. One other thing to think about is...these days I'm not doing any recording...everything I practice is meant to be performed LIVE. Which, for me, means higher volume AND intensity. Rock on my brothers(and sisters too of course )

ronws, excellent points. I think your demo is great at illustrating this. At 1.5 feet, it(vocal) still has an acoustic feel without being "overwhelmed" or "lost" by the room acoustics. Also, I've stated before that I'm right there with you on the crappy mic sounds. For training purposes though, I kind of like having the vocals completely dry(no effects or compression.) Guitartrek, if you don't mind helping me, you seem to be a complete bad-ass at engineering vocals(based on your demos.) What is it that gives the vocal "presence"? Is it just capturing certain frequencies in the voice(along with having a great condenser mic, compressing,expanding,various effects?) The most extreme example I can think of is AC/DC. Man Brian's vocals are(were) so ballsy and brassy and in your face(thinking about hearing Back in Black for first time as a kid.) Actually...he may be the perfect example of what I'm trying to get at here(that "fake belt" sound but sounding HUGE on the recording.) Found a funny link with Brian and Jim Breuer here: Love the "check me voice" bit at the beginning. Now that's feckin' rock n roll :)

Hello all, been thinking about this for awhile. It may just be a me thing ...but what I found very confusing when I started "vocal training" was: the difference between the "recorded" sound and what was actually(acoustically) being sung. I found that what I was hearing, whether coming through a PA system or on a record, was this HUGE sound. So...off I would go trying to emulate it, and then ending up "forcing" the voice/blowing it out. It took me quite a long time to accept that what I was hearing was not in fact as loud/belty(for the most part) as what the recording led me to believe. I think the coolest thing that really opened my mind up was hearing stuff on youtube A Capella(all backing tracks stripped out.) This obviously is still boosted with the most expensive recording equipment out there...but it started helping me "pull the curtain back" so to speak. With that in mind, I started noticing that our own demos, when recorded at the typical distance from the mic, still obviously "boost" the vocals/give presence/ capture harmonics/etc. While this makes for a nice sounding vocal...it's still hard to really capture what's actually coming out of the mouth(as far as volume for sure.) Add on to that the bells and whistles ( cheap digital technology)and most people can produce a very slick, great sounding demo at home. So, what all of this blathering is leading to is, I've been inspired by Martin H and how he records his demos(far back from the mic, allowing for an acoustic sound.) When he records, you get an idea(obviously still acoustic variables/equipment involved) of how he sounds acoustically. I think it's helpful from a technical/learning perspective to hear this...especially for the people who practice at home WITHOUT AMPLIFICATION. What I'm proposing is recording a "normal" take and then recording one far back from the mic. If anyone is interested, I did a couple of lines from 'Roxanne' to demonstrate(I've been in a Police mood lately.) This one is "close" to the mic(I still have the same shitty voice recorder, so it peaks.) http://www.box.net/shared/o47ogjon7s Next one is "far"(15 feet or so. Have no idea what the "perfect" distance is for this.) http://www.box.net/shared/fca0990ptd I tried to sing both with the same volume, but I'm not a robot and I hate singing a capella. It's also very possible that I "pushed" a little on the farther one, because I knew the mic was FAR AWAY. I tried not to. {It's possible all my years of alcohol abuse have rotted my brain and this idea sounds retarded If so, let me know, it won't be the first time.}

Freddie, one more quick note: I was rushed for time yesterday, but re-listened to Jukebox tonight. Man...you're chops are sick! I hear what you're doin' there...and all I can say is wow. That amount of metal and control is harder than a lot of people realize. Seriously...couple of tweaks and you're stickin that at least as well as Lou. Just wanted to add that.

@ ron: you've got it(I believe ) @Daniel: Curbing = "mix" in SS terminology Twang = pharyngeal in SS terminology

Daniel, again...great melody man. Your other song has been stuck in my head for last couple of days. I would download that song in a second! As far as this one goes...it's really a matter of what you want artistically. There are many many different approaches, so, ultimately the question is do you want the "flip" or not. The "OH" vowel, if kept pure, will be a "belt" or Overdrive(CVT) vowel. No problem at all in that part of your range, but you're gonna need to allow the sound to get loud(er). I think your difficulty is you're trying to keep the volume consistent(medium-ish volume) and that vowel needs more volume than you're allowing there. If you want to keep the volume consistent, you might try directing the vowel towards UH(instead of OH) as you go up in the Chorus(ex. OH-OH-UH-UH-UH-OH...just coloring or shading the UH through the OH.) Just a quick idea :)

Snax, are you getting the itch to get back out and start performing again...or are you just gonna serenade the Muskies?

Freddie, you know I support ya brother! You've got serious pipes. Instead of dissecting everything, I'll just state what I loved. Good Lovin': starting at the bridge @ :45 - til the end. Your tone and timbre just locked into place. Sounded authentic to me. The first section was fine technically, but not quite right for my taste. Also, I think your distortions are PERFECT. Never too much. I guess if you could capture the tone you had at that section in Good Lovin' and applied it to everything...would be a knockout. But I'm strictly speaking about MY personal taste. Not technique at all. I think if you leaned a little more towards Tom Jones, it would balance your voice out. And for me, how you sang the above section in 'Good Lovin,' is how I would describe your vocals as "leaning towards Tom Jones." It had that slight lower larynx darkness that really worked for me. Hope that makes sense. And kick ass job.

Rick, another nice one brother! What you're calling "strained" could also be called "plaintive" which is a requirement for that mode(Curbing/Mix/Cry.) What stops you from taking that sound higher/flipping into falsetto?

Wow. Amazing job Geno!

ron...have you thought about backing up, say 10-15 ft(or whatever works) and recording with room ambience? I've had the same problems and started doing this(got the idea from Martin H.) Obviously you will not get "presence" but certainly makes it very easy to hear what's going on "acoustically." Kind of hides the smoke and mirrors and certainly wouldn't peak. Just thinkin' out loud.

Man, Very impressive songwriting...seriously. Also, I would kill for your guitar tone(and certainly technique.) As far as vocals...I'm of the opinion that as long as it feels good and sounds the way you want it to sound..it's all good. They were both viable options and should be considered as additional sound colors for your vocal palette. I personally liked your "usual way," but thought the "relaxed way" worked too. I see no problem in mixing 'em up in a song(to give a little more color and variety.) Great sound.

I'm a fan man! I hear some support issues here and there(which made some notes shaky,) but I'm sure it was from playing and singing at the same time. Your voice is killer(IMO.) As Jens has stated...it's nice to hear something other than screeching tenor stuff once in a while :)

I hear ya brother....as a music whore myself I have to survive "Sugar", BEP's, Lady Gaga, etc. on a weekly basis. Interestingly, I never listen to rap at home, but love to perform it. Same goes for hard rock. About the greatest high in the world(for me) is running and wailing like a demented rock banshee onstage. While at home my Itunes will be shuffling from Nina Simone to Waylon Jennings I love the subtext you put in. I think some people(myself included for sure) tend to "mail it in" when performing certain cover tunes.

Jens...one of the best voices I've ever heard. Holy shit that dude's got tone for days! ronws, Hat's off to the accompaniment and vocals. Hell-a-tough song to tackle. Kudos brother. [EDIT] Sorry Ron...in the spirit of all your trivia, had to add this link(I'm off tonight and home alone and bored so...) Here's the SAME GUY(Steve Balsamo) singing this pop crap. WARNING: head may explode if you just listened to his Gethsemane:

mvrasseli, I have to be honest...your voice is exactly the kind of voice I would listen to for personal pleasure(as opposed to all this acrobatic BS I need for performance.) Man that phrasing that you call "lazy" coupled with your accent is feckin' genius(IMO.) I really think it's the quirks and imperfections in one's own voice that give it originality. There are thousands upon thousands of cookie-cutter technicians(look at all the vocal mill bullshit with '{insert country} Idol ' or {insert country}'s Got Talent.) What they are missing are the quirks that make a voice captivating(to me at least.) Dude...record an album and I would buy it! No shit.

joshual, great to hear you sing man! I think you've done an excellent job capturing the attitude of his version. It really helps hearing the version you were working from: Jonpall had some excellent suggestions with vowel work. I think what you are referring to as "bite" is quite simply twang and some light distortion. I don't think you are too chesty...but I feel like you may be trying to generate the bite by pushing just a bit up top. Jonpall and Jens have done some excellent recordings w/ twang in the high range(distortion too.) That's really what you're looking for. It's light but definitely has bite. Have you worked witches cackle/duck quacking/diving aeroplane/cat meeeeowing(without oo)/etc.? I really feel like you are at least 90% there and just need a couple of tweaks to get the sound you want. {Don't forget that "distortion" will mask some really light sounds and make them sound way bigger and badder.}

Hells yeah man!

Hell yeah brother! Starting to sound like your "old" self.

Good one Jonpall! I was gonna link to Ken's version the other day...but got lazy :)