MDEW

"(guitar) play it properly (something I can't do "
Learn the Basics first.........Chords........Progressions.......Rhythm............    The rest is subject to opinion and choices.  First and foremost a single guitar provides a basic rhythm (beat) and basic chord structure accompaniment for the singing.  The rest is embellishment that is learned a little at a time while gaining confidence.  Much faster this way than trying to perfect the embellishments first.

Someone will have to give me a ride..........My tire is flat.  If I start walking now I can be there by september.  Should I bring chips?

Cool, 2 songs in one day. Somebody's working hard(Or playing hard). Sounds pretty good. It seems in this on as in the other...you have the notes but not confident in them. Perhaps practicing this one a half step higher for a little while and then bringing it back down to the key you are now playing in.
 It still sounds pretty good but you asked for tips on improving it.

Sounds pretty Good Gneetap, It seems that the higher notes are there but you are not confident about them. You are not out of pitch or anything like that and it sounds good.
I do not know if I can give any tips because I notice the same thing in my singing.

Hi muffinhead, congrats on your progress man! I think that in order to take the most out of the sirens you should try not to rush through them, especially at the passagio, so you are not avoiding the area, and build the muscle memory of the coordination needed. Good job

.......  it helps me to stay OUT of the mood of the song. I don't want to be "shoved" or "crowded" into the artistic "work space" before or after I perform the art. The vocal mic / booth / reflection filter is a very tight, confined space. I have a limited threshold for putting my nose and face up into the microphone staring cross-eyed at the microphone. It isn't necessarily an "open" feeling of freedom... I move to my work space, when I begin to do my job.
Also, on a more pragmatic point,... just standing there starring at the microphone for a minute prior to the song or after the song, in my view is a wee bit dorky. When I start, I start. When I'm done, I'm done... I want to stay out of that space as much as I can and get a refresher... 
Similar to putting a book down and letting your eyes and brain rest for a while before you pick it up again.
Good question... 

OK, this is it.......... You will have to put up with the out of tune guitar until someone buys me an expensive one. Capo on the 5th fret doesn't help things. Cowboy chords, Folk Style.
I am Keeping this microphone.

I guess this is a carbon copy of Bonnie Raitt .
Thanks Bzean,   I tried to find the correct chords for my cover but nothing seemed to work so I fudged a little.

OK, this is it.......... You will have to put up with the out of tune guitar until someone buys me an expensive one. Capo on the 5th fret doesn't help things. Cowboy chords, Folk Style.
I am Keeping this microphone.

OK, this is it.......... You will have to put up with the out of tune guitar until someone buys me an expensive one. Capo on the 5th fret doesn't help things. Cowboy chords, Folk Style.
I am Keeping this microphone.

I guess this is a carbon copy of Bonnie Raitt .
Thanks Bzean,   I tried to find the correct chords for my cover but nothing seemed to work so I fudged a little.

OK, this is it.......... You will have to put up with the out of tune guitar until someone buys me an expensive one. Capo on the 5th fret doesn't help things. Cowboy chords, Folk Style.
I am Keeping this microphone.

OK, this is it.......... You will have to put up with the out of tune guitar until someone buys me an expensive one. Capo on the 5th fret doesn't help things. Cowboy chords, Folk Style.
I am Keeping this microphone.

I know you have heard or read this a thousand times Robert, But it never gets old............ THANK YOU! What you have done with the FOUR PILLARS is just AWESOME!  I cannot say that I have reached my goal or anything, but I am a bad student. But that does not diminish the fact that FOUR PILLARS is an awesome product that will take you where you want to go with your singing IF you give it the chance it deserves.
       I do not think that I will ever be able to meet you in person or be a real student but anyone who does have that chance should take it.
        I know that Robert is a dedicated Teacher and Coach that has the interest of the student along with the physical act of the Art of singing as his main focus. You cannot go wrong with someone whose main purpose is for his students to excel in this craft.

I am not trying to be a jerk. I am trying to help. The vocals need to be heard clear and on top of the guitars.
The vocals are totally buried by the music.   The first and best tip that I can give you is to listen back to your recordings. At least get the vocals loud enough that you can truely hear how you sound.

Draven, I just saw this... 
For starters, is vocal fatigue normal after working onsets?  Yes, especially for beginners, (and in a sense you are also a beginner with these new onsets, at least for a while), but it also depends on which onsets your doing and that is the part that in interesting to me in your post.
1). I don't believe it is the messa di voce that is creating fatigue. That is actually a "Coordination and Tuning" onset and as such, it is a bit lighter in its nature. It is a finesse onset not a resistance training onset. However, I am really glad to hear that you are using that onset. It is good for helping students to find the musculature in a  work flow sequence, inside their head voice... I'm assuming you realize that because you seem like a good 4Pillars student.
2). The fatigue is likely coming from the contract and release onset. Hey,... that onset HAS to be done with prudence. I use that onset ONLY when others are not getting me the result I need in the head voice, and that is extremely rare!
3). I think your possibly leading with the wrong onsets. Draven, the day to day, meat and potatoes onsets that I use every day , that you should be using every day with your students are;
Coordination & Tuning Onsets:
T&R
Q&R
W&R
Resistance Training Onsets:
D&R
A&R
 
Daven, have you seen the Integrated Training Routines in your copy of 4Pillars?  PLEASE WATCH THE "COORDINATION & TUNING" AND "RESISTANCE" : ONSETS & SIRENS ROUTINES  in your copy of 4Pillars. You have to learn how to build ITRs especially as a voice teacher!
The Anatomy of an ITR:
1. There is an onset & offset. (strategically selected. Used for a reason that you understand, because you studied and understand the onsets).
2. A vocalize. (some kind of workout in the middle or the "venue").
3. Acoustic Mode. (the vowels... the "medium" inside the workout is... the acoustics, the vowels!  And like the onsets, you don't just randomly do any vowel. You choose vowels for a specific purpose).
 
So I just think, you are diving into the onsets with not enough understanding at the moment. And as such, you are choosing the two onsets that are actually, speciality items. They are the two onsets I use the least. M&R and C&R onsets are like the special funky wrench in the tool box that you only use once in a while. Most of the time, you need to be using the ones I mentioned above. And you want to be real smart about the onsets. The TVS onsets don't mean squat if you don't understand what each of them is doing for you. I"m assuming you mostly do, because you're a good student... but that includes, being able to use the ITRs and ultimately, know how to build your OWN ITRs... When you understand the onsets and vowels thoroughly , you can then begin to create your own ITRs and prescribe them to your students. Although, 9 out of 10 of the ITRs you will ever need have already been created and demonstrated for you in the ITR module... 
The short of it is... get of the C&R onset... if you want to build head voices, move to D&R and A&R onsets, with melodic 5th and octave sirens... but only after a good warm up. 
This response assumes that you are also doing the nasal consonant buzzing routines to warm up as well. If your not doing that and just crashing straight into C&R onsets, then no wonder your getting tired.
 

I've already posted my praise for Robert and TFPOS, but I'll do it again in this thread. The program is great and provides virtually everything you need to know about singing, and how to do it. The extent of detail into which the TVS methodology goes into explaining the purpose of exercises and how singing works is astounding, and far beyond what you would normally encounter from a voice coach and/or vocal program. I have improved a bunch since I started practicing with TFPOS, and still have so much to learn. I can tell that Robert is truly passionate about teaching for the sake of knowledge and the success of his students, which really shows that he will do his best to ensure that you get the guidance and help you need to become a great singer. Thank you Robert, for opening my eyes not only about how to sing, but also what it means to be a singer. 

I like testimonials like this. From regular guys who are not used to giving testimonials. Not that you would ever script a thing for someone to say. And he is like a lot of singers. Good at singing and entertaining but speaking personally, he is more likely to search for words and expressions, as the rest of us do.

Here is one for Glenn. I decided to just go ahead and post it as is. The more I messed with it the worse it got.
Comments welcome anyway.............
 
 

Reminds me of a cute line from a young lady I knew who's boyfriend was 100 percent Cherokee, medicine braid and everything.

Thanks Gneetapp,  I still may need to change the Mic back to be sure.

Good song. Wish I would have thought of it.
I think you are just trying to go a little too heavy on it. Sounds pretty good anyway.
If it makes you feel any better John had a hard time singing this too.
Write this on your song list to sing for people. Keep a list and sing them often. Then when opportunity strikes you are ready to go.

This was a contribution to the "Legends Lost" thread.  Glenn Fry passed earlier this year.
I found an old microphone while searching through my things and thought I would try it out. I am not sure how I ended up with it. It turns out that this is an Electrovoice 635A. An interview microphone used by reporters and such. I was using a Shure PE50 super pro(sm57 and sm58 were based on this) and I am not sure if the vocal improvement is from the Microphone or if Lessons are starting to pay off. Anyway I can tell a difference in the sound from this effort and songs recorded a week ago.
  Any comments welcome good or bad......improvement is the goal. I am aware of the harmony being flat in the final verse. It was getting late and time to stop. Still a major improvement from other efforts.
 

Thanks Ronws, I agree that this is the best so far, and why I mentioned the electrovoice Microphone. I tried a new approach to singing also and still not sure which one made the difference in sound the microphone or the actual voice...........But I am Keeping this Mic.

This was a contribution to the "Legends Lost" thread.  Glenn Fry passed earlier this year.
I found an old microphone while searching through my things and thought I would try it out. I am not sure how I ended up with it. It turns out that this is an Electrovoice 635A. An interview microphone used by reporters and such. I was using a Shure PE50 super pro(sm57 and sm58 were based on this) and I am not sure if the vocal improvement is from the Microphone or if Lessons are starting to pay off. Anyway I can tell a difference in the sound from this effort and songs recorded a week ago.
  Any comments welcome good or bad......improvement is the goal. I am aware of the harmony being flat in the final verse. It was getting late and time to stop. Still a major improvement from other efforts.