JonJon

Coming very soon!

I used a lot of sirens on different vowels, but there r lots of different exercises out there. Play around and have fun

ill give u a short answer. the falsetto means the vocal cords are mostly open. You have the level of strength and skill to close the vocal cords to make good notes up to f4 which is, as you said, chest voice. Thats basically the same voice you speak in so you are pretty well trained in configuring and using your voice that way
BUT, that type of setup will only go so high and then its starts getting really tight and strained, right?? I think most people, including me, start off that exact way. I was the same, I had chest voice which went to a certain note and then choked out and then i had falsetto
in essence, you need to learn how to sing in head voice. You can take that falsetto and work with it to make it brighter, tighter and more focused and eventually you end up with a legit head voice. You are going to feel most of the vibration etc ABOVE the lower throat. In other words you wont be feeling the same sensations as in a strong chest voice. You might feel it buzzing up in the nose some, or up on the hard or soft palates (roof of the mouth) or behind the eyes or on the upper back of the throat or who knows where, somewhere in the head area lol.
Good vowels to play around with are 'ee's and "oo"s. if you can take a nice "ee" or 'oo" and maybe add a bit more compression to it and get it nice and buzzy and bright, then you are probably getting into good headvoice.
 
Then its a matter of learning to connect ("bridge") the chest and headvoices together. I struggled like heck to bridge, mainly because I didnt have a headvoice yet. once I felt a good headvoice for the first time, I bridged down into chest voice like 3 seconds later lol
I was trying to sing this certain rock song. I was straining to get higher, but stuck at a certain point in chest voice. Then id sing that part in falsetto but it didnt sound right. So that was my thought process. 1) chest voice wont go that high and 2) falsetto doesnt sound right so the magic answer was: THERE MUST BE SOMETHING ELSE. That something else is correct headvoice
 
-------------------
 
As far as trying to keep pushing chest voice higher. Ok, in general as u continue to get better etc, yes, your chest voice can be developed higher. BUT, thats not a substitute for learning how to sing in a good headvoice. ESPECIALLY if you are already sort of straining and getting stuck and choked at a certain point in your chest voice.....straining even harder wont help.
instead of straining harder youll have to learn how to let the sound move up out of your lower throat only and move up higher more onto the roof off the mouth etc as I described above. The sound may also feel as if it moves "back" into the back of the head as you sing higher notes. Just squeezing chest harder and harder wont work
if you are yelling to try to go higher, then you need to do the opposite instead. Instead of spreading the sound out really big and wide (splatting) and losing control, you need to keep the sound tighter and more focused and let the feel of vibration move out of the throat and higher into the mouth/nose/roof of mouth etc
You mention F4. Generally an average male tenor type of voice will start feeling sort of tight etc as he starts getting into the sort of d4-d#4-e4 area. Sounds like thats about right for you and then you sort of lean into it and strain and squeeze it u to f4 but then that strategy runs out of steam. Instead, as you start to get into that d4e4 area, start letting the sound move out of your throat and up higher as I describe above
Peace, JJ

I used a lot of sirens on different vowels, but there r lots of different exercises out there. Play around and have fun

I used a lot of sirens on different vowels, but there r lots of different exercises out there. Play around and have fun

ill give u a short answer. the falsetto means the vocal cords are mostly open. You have the level of strength and skill to close the vocal cords to make good notes up to f4 which is, as you said, chest voice. Thats basically the same voice you speak in so you are pretty well trained in configuring and using your voice that way
BUT, that type of setup will only go so high and then its starts getting really tight and strained, right?? I think most people, including me, start off that exact way. I was the same, I had chest voice which went to a certain note and then choked out and then i had falsetto
in essence, you need to learn how to sing in head voice. You can take that falsetto and work with it to make it brighter, tighter and more focused and eventually you end up with a legit head voice. You are going to feel most of the vibration etc ABOVE the lower throat. In other words you wont be feeling the same sensations as in a strong chest voice. You might feel it buzzing up in the nose some, or up on the hard or soft palates (roof of the mouth) or behind the eyes or on the upper back of the throat or who knows where, somewhere in the head area lol.
Good vowels to play around with are 'ee's and "oo"s. if you can take a nice "ee" or 'oo" and maybe add a bit more compression to it and get it nice and buzzy and bright, then you are probably getting into good headvoice.
 
Then its a matter of learning to connect ("bridge") the chest and headvoices together. I struggled like heck to bridge, mainly because I didnt have a headvoice yet. once I felt a good headvoice for the first time, I bridged down into chest voice like 3 seconds later lol
I was trying to sing this certain rock song. I was straining to get higher, but stuck at a certain point in chest voice. Then id sing that part in falsetto but it didnt sound right. So that was my thought process. 1) chest voice wont go that high and 2) falsetto doesnt sound right so the magic answer was: THERE MUST BE SOMETHING ELSE. That something else is correct headvoice
 
-------------------
 
As far as trying to keep pushing chest voice higher. Ok, in general as u continue to get better etc, yes, your chest voice can be developed higher. BUT, thats not a substitute for learning how to sing in a good headvoice. ESPECIALLY if you are already sort of straining and getting stuck and choked at a certain point in your chest voice.....straining even harder wont help.
instead of straining harder youll have to learn how to let the sound move up out of your lower throat only and move up higher more onto the roof off the mouth etc as I described above. The sound may also feel as if it moves "back" into the back of the head as you sing higher notes. Just squeezing chest harder and harder wont work
if you are yelling to try to go higher, then you need to do the opposite instead. Instead of spreading the sound out really big and wide (splatting) and losing control, you need to keep the sound tighter and more focused and let the feel of vibration move out of the throat and higher into the mouth/nose/roof of mouth etc
You mention F4. Generally an average male tenor type of voice will start feeling sort of tight etc as he starts getting into the sort of d4-d#4-e4 area. Sounds like thats about right for you and then you sort of lean into it and strain and squeeze it u to f4 but then that strategy runs out of steam. Instead, as you start to get into that d4e4 area, start letting the sound move out of your throat and up higher as I describe above
Peace, JJ

ill give u a short answer. the falsetto means the vocal cords are mostly open. You have the level of strength and skill to close the vocal cords to make good notes up to f4 which is, as you said, chest voice. Thats basically the same voice you speak in so you are pretty well trained in configuring and using your voice that way
BUT, that type of setup will only go so high and then its starts getting really tight and strained, right?? I think most people, including me, start off that exact way. I was the same, I had chest voice which went to a certain note and then choked out and then i had falsetto
in essence, you need to learn how to sing in head voice. You can take that falsetto and work with it to make it brighter, tighter and more focused and eventually you end up with a legit head voice. You are going to feel most of the vibration etc ABOVE the lower throat. In other words you wont be feeling the same sensations as in a strong chest voice. You might feel it buzzing up in the nose some, or up on the hard or soft palates (roof of the mouth) or behind the eyes or on the upper back of the throat or who knows where, somewhere in the head area lol.
Good vowels to play around with are 'ee's and "oo"s. if you can take a nice "ee" or 'oo" and maybe add a bit more compression to it and get it nice and buzzy and bright, then you are probably getting into good headvoice.
 
Then its a matter of learning to connect ("bridge") the chest and headvoices together. I struggled like heck to bridge, mainly because I didnt have a headvoice yet. once I felt a good headvoice for the first time, I bridged down into chest voice like 3 seconds later lol
I was trying to sing this certain rock song. I was straining to get higher, but stuck at a certain point in chest voice. Then id sing that part in falsetto but it didnt sound right. So that was my thought process. 1) chest voice wont go that high and 2) falsetto doesnt sound right so the magic answer was: THERE MUST BE SOMETHING ELSE. That something else is correct headvoice
 
-------------------
 
As far as trying to keep pushing chest voice higher. Ok, in general as u continue to get better etc, yes, your chest voice can be developed higher. BUT, thats not a substitute for learning how to sing in a good headvoice. ESPECIALLY if you are already sort of straining and getting stuck and choked at a certain point in your chest voice.....straining even harder wont help.
instead of straining harder youll have to learn how to let the sound move up out of your lower throat only and move up higher more onto the roof off the mouth etc as I described above. The sound may also feel as if it moves "back" into the back of the head as you sing higher notes. Just squeezing chest harder and harder wont work
if you are yelling to try to go higher, then you need to do the opposite instead. Instead of spreading the sound out really big and wide (splatting) and losing control, you need to keep the sound tighter and more focused and let the feel of vibration move out of the throat and higher into the mouth/nose/roof of mouth etc
You mention F4. Generally an average male tenor type of voice will start feeling sort of tight etc as he starts getting into the sort of d4-d#4-e4 area. Sounds like thats about right for you and then you sort of lean into it and strain and squeeze it u to f4 but then that strategy runs out of steam. Instead, as you start to get into that d4e4 area, start letting the sound move out of your throat and up higher as I describe above
Peace, JJ

ill give u a short answer. the falsetto means the vocal cords are mostly open. You have the level of strength and skill to close the vocal cords to make good notes up to f4 which is, as you said, chest voice. Thats basically the same voice you speak in so you are pretty well trained in configuring and using your voice that way
BUT, that type of setup will only go so high and then its starts getting really tight and strained, right?? I think most people, including me, start off that exact way. I was the same, I had chest voice which went to a certain note and then choked out and then i had falsetto
in essence, you need to learn how to sing in head voice. You can take that falsetto and work with it to make it brighter, tighter and more focused and eventually you end up with a legit head voice. You are going to feel most of the vibration etc ABOVE the lower throat. In other words you wont be feeling the same sensations as in a strong chest voice. You might feel it buzzing up in the nose some, or up on the hard or soft palates (roof of the mouth) or behind the eyes or on the upper back of the throat or who knows where, somewhere in the head area lol.
Good vowels to play around with are 'ee's and "oo"s. if you can take a nice "ee" or 'oo" and maybe add a bit more compression to it and get it nice and buzzy and bright, then you are probably getting into good headvoice.
 
Then its a matter of learning to connect ("bridge") the chest and headvoices together. I struggled like heck to bridge, mainly because I didnt have a headvoice yet. once I felt a good headvoice for the first time, I bridged down into chest voice like 3 seconds later lol
I was trying to sing this certain rock song. I was straining to get higher, but stuck at a certain point in chest voice. Then id sing that part in falsetto but it didnt sound right. So that was my thought process. 1) chest voice wont go that high and 2) falsetto doesnt sound right so the magic answer was: THERE MUST BE SOMETHING ELSE. That something else is correct headvoice
 
-------------------
 
As far as trying to keep pushing chest voice higher. Ok, in general as u continue to get better etc, yes, your chest voice can be developed higher. BUT, thats not a substitute for learning how to sing in a good headvoice. ESPECIALLY if you are already sort of straining and getting stuck and choked at a certain point in your chest voice.....straining even harder wont help.
instead of straining harder youll have to learn how to let the sound move up out of your lower throat only and move up higher more onto the roof off the mouth etc as I described above. The sound may also feel as if it moves "back" into the back of the head as you sing higher notes. Just squeezing chest harder and harder wont work
if you are yelling to try to go higher, then you need to do the opposite instead. Instead of spreading the sound out really big and wide (splatting) and losing control, you need to keep the sound tighter and more focused and let the feel of vibration move out of the throat and higher into the mouth/nose/roof of mouth etc
You mention F4. Generally an average male tenor type of voice will start feeling sort of tight etc as he starts getting into the sort of d4-d#4-e4 area. Sounds like thats about right for you and then you sort of lean into it and strain and squeeze it u to f4 but then that strategy runs out of steam. Instead, as you start to get into that d4e4 area, start letting the sound move out of your throat and up higher as I describe above
Peace, JJ

I find that when i try to imitate ray charles the sound is placed really forward against my front teeth, like im chewing a bubble lol
diagram is rlly helpful thx so much for taking the time to oost that. Ill take notes and record results

I feel u, I live in a quiet apt too lol. my poor neighbors. A couple of years ago i was trying to record some Gregorian chant. Im pretty sure they thought I was worshiping the devil or something

Im worried about volume becaus my apartments pretty small and the walls r thin. Its not so much an insecurity, im just tryna be considerate to my neighbors lol Only time i rlly get to belt anything is in the car or when i have enough money to rent out a studio for an hr. Its hard but im managing. But yes, i realize that ray charles is pretty loud, nver had a problem w that. Thx!

I am actually a fan of ray charles, hope that answers ur first question. Ive always thought john was a baritone but he sound a bit like a tenor the more i listen to him.
Any specific exercises that help w engaging the muscles w cord closure?ill pot a video of my "headvoice" once i get home, thx

drunk tenor? lol
tbh, I dont think anyone can tell much from that clip because you're not really singing lol. You are almost sort of half talking/half singing.  Id be worried about hurting my voice by singing all light and scratchy like that. Probably could tell more from just your speaking voice...or go ahead and sing something where you are actually holding a note so we can hear your real voice etc
In any case, "am I baritone or tenor" is like the most asked question on singing forums....buts its really like the least important thing in the world. Those terms come from classical singing and opera and they dont really have a lot to do with contemporary pop singing. Whether or not we are "baritones" or "tenors" we still want to develop a large range and all of our skills and tone etc etc
I would think that the typical male with an average speaking voice etc is going to be something like a high baritone or a low tenor or something along those lines
 
Peace, JJ

obviously I am not a doctor...and I have never had allergies. You say you saw a doctor....was it an E.N.T. doc?
 
the singing itself is VERY light. If you always sing that lightly, it will be sort of hard to relate to a lot of singing advice you may come across. I dont hear anything in there resembling any type of "belt" at all and I dont really hear anything that sounds 'supported'.  This is the kind of singing someone can do almost without breathing at all.
As a long term goal, id advise you to learn to support and simply start singing "stronger" for lack of a better term. I dont see how you can develop any muscular strength and coordination singing as light as that example. Even styles such as Bruno Mars have to have a certain amount of strength to hit some of the notes with clarity. Of course for Aretha or Whitney or Chaka or BoyzIIMen, you will have to be very strong etc
of course if you are having vocal health/allergy issues then obviously the singing will be affected.
 
I try to do a lot of light humming as a type of therapy to relax my vocal cords and obviously there is a limit to how much one can sing or do singing training. There has to be a balance of stress (singing, training, talking) versus relaxation, therapy, hydration etc etc. Talking on the phone or talking at work (loud warehouse) hurts my voice more than singing
 
That being said, you show good control and skills so thats a good start. Im gonna guess you are probably 25 Y.O. or younger? Why do I guess that? That is sort of the modern age group that places WAY too much emphasis on doing "runs". They do a few runs and think they are some kind of outstanding singer. If you take a Chaka or Prince or Stevie Wonder, there is much more there than a bunch of "runs".
 
She is pretty light thru this song, but listen to the end where she uses a bit of power. And this is nothing for her.
 
if you always sing light and sort of airy you will never develop the strength to get that kind of bright edge
 
Im wondering if singing lightly all the time can actually irritate your vocal cords? Dunno

in general, people arent going to see posts you make in your journal. Usually a journal is more like a diary where you keep track of your own progress etc. Most actual discussions take place under       SINGING & TRAINING TECHNIQUES-->General Discussions
 
if you think that video was argumentative, you aint seen nothing yet and you might ought to fasten your seatbelt. You will find that its almost IMPOSSIBLE to actually discuss singing using text words lol. no one agrees on what the terms mean and people use different terms for the same thing sometimes and vice versa. Then some people want to force the rest of the world to use whatever brand of terminology that person has learned. Its very frustrating to all involved. My advice...just try to understand what people actually mean as opposed to how they go about saying it
I felt bad because some of my threads ended up in arguments. I didnt feel so bad when I searched back on the forum and saw these same exact arguments over the same exact terms going on 6-8 years before I joined the forum lol. And its the same on all singing forums and music forums in general
 
If you feel brave, search for these terms: belting, support, head voice. hehe, good luck

Hi it's me again. 
Please go to this link to hear me sing
https://singing-with-a-deviated-septum.tumblr.com/post/166724849854
The pain is not in the following song. But after singing it six times the pain registers again.
I have registered two pains. 
1 sore throat 
2 sore neck
I personally believe that diaphragm breathing alleviates the second pain but not the first. Cause that feels like a flu. And that's my main problem with my allergies. I can push through neck pain but not throat pain. My doctor said drink tea & take lozenges, exercise 30 minutes a day, warm up before singing, get rid of the dust causing my allergies. wash my sheets in 70 degree water. 
I have done all of the above. But the sore throat is still here. Even if I talk excessively at work it hurts, right now I'm healing my throat with lozenges, because of a 7 minute call I had with a friend. This has never happened before. 
I'm sending an email later today to my doctor. But I really wanted to post this version in the interim, to get feedback am I still shouting as opposed to singing?
I tried incorporating the belt into the singing, but I felt I was only able to do that when the note wasn't complex e.g "whaaaaaat" at the end vs ("half of it, this the life I live" section).
Thank you for helping ❤

Hello Robert and Hello to all!
 
I just ordered the TVS program and am excited to start working on my singing.
 
Quick bio. 48 Y.O. male from southside Virginia. I have played lead guitar since 1988. After taking many years away from home recording, I got back into it about 18 months ago and had to learn the new DAWs etc from scratch.
To make a long story short, I have about 50 "songs" on my hard drive that need vox. I also have quite a few lyrics written without any music etc. It has been difficult (impossible) for me to find any singers to work with so the next logical step is to just develop my own singing voice more. Hopefully it is not too late. Besides which, I love to sing even if I am not very technically aware at this moment.
As far as singing, I want to sing rock, classic rock, 80-90s rock, grunge, bluesy styles etc. In my songs I generally find myself in sort of the style of VH, Rainbow, Whitesnake, LedZep....sort of melodic and bluesy stuff. (at least thats the aim, hehe)
My fave singers in no order. Ann Wilson, David Coverdale, Goran Edman, John Sykes, Glenn Hughes, Mark Slaughter, Marq Torien, Barry Gibb, Layne Staley and many others. I am not fixated on copying anyone though, I just want to develop my own innate abilities. My dream song might be "Love Kills" by Mark Slaughter when he was with Vinnie Vincent, but again, its not a fixation. (Im aware Mark had a pretty high voice lol)
My current estimation of my singing abilities? I have potential to have a nice voice etc but am pretty clueless technically and totally untrained lol. Just from browsing vids etc I think I have a good understanding of some of the terminology....chest voice, head voice, falsetto, bridging etc. I understand the concept of vowel modification but have never tried to practice it myself.
I am probably like a lot of other untrained people. If the song happens to "fit" my current capabilities, then I sound decent. But if it doesn't, I sound like a frog that spent the previous day hollering at a sports event. Sometimes I can sing along with the verse to a song but when it goes into the higher chorus part I cant hit that.....or I can hit it but I have to jump up to head voice with no bridging going on lol.
I think my head voice is developed to some degree but there is a no mans land between my chest voice and head voice. If I work on a song I tend to get into a lot of pushing/straining/choking lol. No bridging currently happening. On occasion I also like to throw in some BeeGees falsetto.
Anyway, I am excited to get to work and am looking forward to some nice progress.
I am throwing in this link to a "before" song where I sang and played guitar over an existing rhythm track. This was in Jan 2014. Pretty sure all the vox are doubled. (manually sang twice) Im pretty good at doubling...since I have never thought my voice was good enough to stand on its own yet lol. Any feedback on the singing is welcome. Id be interested as to what my natural range is. I understand it isnt going to be that impressive as it is an untrained voice but maybe we can get an idea of what we are working with and what potential for range and style I might have etc
Thanks a lot for any feedback!
https://clyp.it/egudjvlp
Peace, JonJon

Hi, I posted this a few days ago, but for technical reasons the post was lost. Robert Lunte already kindly reviewed it, but if anyone else feels like giving me (constructive) feedback on singing, songwriting or recording, that would be great. 
It's a prog rock piece just over 8 minutes long, hopefully you'll stick through to the end (which was the hardest part to sing due to the challenging harmonies).
George
 
 
 

yeah thats interesting, Imma check it out

wikiloops is music collaboration.   Its not "backing tracks" per se....in other words its not karaoke stuff.
its all original stuff. people go and upload tracks of all sorts and then anyone can add whatever they want to any track. I think there are like 90000 tracks currently. All genres and members from like 150 countries.
I went there originally to find drum tracks to start my songs with, before I ended up getting EZ Drummer software.
 
Whats the catch? the only catch is that there are musicians there of ALL levels...so therefore the tracks are of all levels lol.
 
Its a VERY friendly and positive place....too friendly in a sense because one can post up anything and people gush all over it....but thats good for people just getting started etc
 
here is one of the tracks from today I clicked on at random with solid girl singer https://www.wikiloops.com/backingtrack-jam-91137.php
If you look at it you see how it was built step by step with people adding to this original track https://www.wikiloops.com/backingtrack-jam-51485.php
 
Great place for people to practice vocals
 
Great site ran by a German guy named Dick.

just some quick vocals I threw onto a Latvian buddys music track (from wikiloops)
I wrote the lyrics around 9pm and I couldnt keep my eyes open and I was going to just do the vox later but I decided to "just lay down a scratch vox track"...but you know how that goes. I was dead tired so this may not be my best but I still dig it even though I was struggling a bit
 
The vibe is a little different than my songs because essentially he never changes chords lol....gives a bit more of a stoner rock feel, which I dig
 
Anyone figure out the story I am paraphrasing in the song?
 
enjoy
https://clyp.it/gf5nc5if
 
okay, actually I am lying, this is just some computer generated vocals based off of a sample of my voice on an answering machine. its all fake. Even the vibrato is a vst. and i was wearing a wig

yeah thats interesting, Imma check it out

wikiloops is music collaboration.   Its not "backing tracks" per se....in other words its not karaoke stuff.
its all original stuff. people go and upload tracks of all sorts and then anyone can add whatever they want to any track. I think there are like 90000 tracks currently. All genres and members from like 150 countries.
I went there originally to find drum tracks to start my songs with, before I ended up getting EZ Drummer software.
 
Whats the catch? the only catch is that there are musicians there of ALL levels...so therefore the tracks are of all levels lol.
 
Its a VERY friendly and positive place....too friendly in a sense because one can post up anything and people gush all over it....but thats good for people just getting started etc
 
here is one of the tracks from today I clicked on at random with solid girl singer https://www.wikiloops.com/backingtrack-jam-91137.php
If you look at it you see how it was built step by step with people adding to this original track https://www.wikiloops.com/backingtrack-jam-51485.php
 
Great place for people to practice vocals
 
Great site ran by a German guy named Dick.

Like I said, I only did the vox. The drums and guitar were done by a buddy over at wikiloops.com
I joined over there like 2 years ago when i was trying to find drum tracks and trying to learn to work a modern DAW. At that time I had no intention of singing. So, as one might expect, there are 9 million guitar players for every 1 singer over there. So I started bitching about the singers not adding vox to my tracks etc etc. lol.  So its funny that I am now singing and I havent even added vox to the dozens of gtr tracks I have over there.
This song was mainly done out of a feeling of guilt because wikiloops really helped get me going again...as I hadnt recorded any music for like a decade b4 getting fired back up 2 years ago. So every once in a while I add vox to someones good gtr track since I know what it meant to me when someone added vox to some of my tracks
 
peace, JJ

Beastly song, nice work man.  Can't say much more than that. Think the melody and guitars syncopated really nice together.